Audio Talk with Parnelli Winner Buford Jones

[00:00:00] This is the Tech Arts Podcast where we talk about tech, leadership and all things that concern church audio, video and lighting. Welcome to the Tech Arts Podcast and the Earthworks Audio Studios. My name is DL. So glad to have you joining us today.

[00:00:24] Today's podcast is jam packed with great information and content. Joining us for today's interview is the legend and Parnelli award winning audio engineer Buford Jones. In this conversation you will get to hear from one of the greatest audio engineers of all

[00:00:38] time, a man who mixed for David Bowie, Faith Hill, Pink Floyd and many more. He pioneered immersive sound mixing and brings a unique perspective to how you should approach an immersive mix. We also talked to James Harding who is the president of Metro Media and Communications.

[00:00:59] He comes into the Earthworks Audio Studios and talks to us about a unique event that is coming up. But first, today's church tech tip is the Soundwire from Sonic. Please welcome to the Tech Arts Podcast David Skortecha.

[00:01:13] Thanks for coming on man and to talk to us about the Soundwire. I hope I didn't butcher your last name too much there. I first found you guys when I was looking for a good audio tester product and I found

[00:01:25] the SoundBullet and being from Texas, the word bullet grabbed my attention. It's an amazing product. We did a church tech tip on just this product. It has noise for testing, headphone jack, onboard mic, 48 volt phantom, in and out for XLR quarter inch. Just a great product.

[00:01:42] And you can see our full review on the TechArtsPodcast.com or you can go to Sonic.com and check it out. But today you have a new product and we're talking about the Soundwire. Before we get into that discussion, David, tell us a little bit about your company.

[00:01:57] Yeah. So I am the founder of Sonect and the creator of the SoundBullet in a way. And yeah, I never really wanted to start a company in my life, but I just thought this idea for this product, which primarily just saved my life in a way.

[00:02:20] It was only thanks to my sound engineer friends that I wanted to make more than one. And then the demand just kept going and then it came the necessity to create an actual company. So yeah, that's the story.

[00:02:38] So we launched the SoundBullet in 2019 after about three years of developing it and creating the specs and stuff. Well, it's my understanding that the SoundBullet came about because you're like, I need a good tester product and this is what I need and no one's making it.

[00:02:57] Is that true? Is that kind of how it came about? Because you're a front house guy that was just like, I need to figure this out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pretty much. I mean, I could find some kind of continuity testers and signal generators, but they

[00:03:10] were all a little bulky. So my idea was to have something that is pocket sized and the actual connections stuck out of the actual device itself so that I could directly plug it into whatever I'm testing.

[00:03:28] So this is why the XLRs stick out and the quarter inch jack as well. Just make it an easy thing to test and kind of sticking with that theme, easy and simple. Then comes the sound wire. You guys sent me one right here.

[00:03:43] So it comes in this really cool package. I just want to show everybody this package. I didn't expect the package. The package is really neat, has a little magnetic lock here. You can kind of hook it to something if you want to carry it around.

[00:03:56] If you want to be that guy that's carrying it on your hip. But it's this really neat package and then inside of it is the cable, a couple XLRs. And then the, let's see if I can get it here. Right here.

[00:04:14] See if I can hold that up for everyone. The USB-C, miniaturized USB-C to plug into your computer and then comes right out to the XLRs. Tell us a little bit about this. I mean, it's such a slick design, sleek and slick design, but I know it's

[00:04:33] more than just a connector and XLR. So tell us a little bit more about this cable. Yeah. So that is the kind of the challenge that it looks like a cable, but it just holds so much more.

[00:04:48] I think this idea came about right after when we released the sound bullet. And I just always found it very inconvenient to do something really simple like playing music from your computer, from your laptop, from your smartphone into a desk.

[00:05:09] You needed so many boxes and connections and cables. Like 10 different boxes, DIs and make sure it doesn't, you know, phantom doesn't mess it up. You need all these little things. Yes. And then the phantom thing happened.

[00:05:23] I like I fried two of my own MacBook Pros just because somebody accidentally put phantom on that line. And I probably shouldn't say this here, but I actually fried somebody else's laptop, but you know, I can never told them.

[00:05:39] And I just kind of thought that that's such a silly thing, you know, for such a little button that could be pressed by mistake, you know, it's something really, really bad that can happen. So yeah, I just wanted to fix this and make it super simple, streamline the

[00:05:54] whole thing and kind of just have one straight connection from, you know, from the playback device to the desk without nothing in between and without worrying about, you know, phantom power and balancing the signal and all that.

[00:06:08] Well, what kind of quality does this cable provide to the end user who's just plugging it in? I'm assuming they just plug it into their computer and boom, they get sound out of it. It almost feels like it's a miniature sound card. It pretty much is. Yes.

[00:06:23] So it's it's a DAC chip that is the same DAC that's used in kind of audio files, you know, DAC converters. The quality you can get is 192 kilohertz at 32 bit. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Stop, stop right there. A hundred and ninety two kilohertz at 32 bit on this cable. Yes.

[00:06:46] Well, inside just inside the, you know, the USB-C housing. Just inside the housing? Yes. There are about like 50 components inside the, you know, the actual like USB-C is just packed with like so much like electronic stuff going on.

[00:07:03] And it's that's the that's where the money is in a way. That's where the money is. Well, I mean, it truly is a sound card then if you're able to seamlessly do a hundred and ninety two kilohertz, 32 bit audio directly

[00:07:17] from the mixing console through just through just one connection. It basically is a sound interface. Talk, talk a little bit about the XLR though. You know, you just talked about frying computers with 48 volt phantom. What are you doing inside the XLR to protect from that?

[00:07:35] And is it balanced? I mean, what's going on inside the XLR? Yeah. So one of the most fun challenges with this product that, you know, the whole thing kind of took about three years to, to make, you know, into a product.

[00:07:47] It was to find a transformer, which could actually fit inside the housing of the XLR. We couldn't find one. So we had to like design our own, which took like forever. And yeah, so like the transformer inside the XLR is what protects,

[00:08:07] you know, like the sound wire and the device that you plug to it from accidentally powered, you know, phantom power. And it also beautifully just does the balancing for you. So, so, you know, you don't need to use a DI box. You just plug it straight in.

[00:08:24] So it's protecting my computer against phantom power. It's balancing the audio just like a DI box. I don't need a big bulky DI box in line. Yeah. The XLR that you have and the transformer and everything is doing all of that. Yes.

[00:08:41] Don't know if you can see it on the inside, but I can, man. I can. And it's like, you know, inside the cast as well, just to kind of, you know, make it super strong and yeah.

[00:08:51] So that this, I'm really, I'm really happy that we managed to pull this off because it, yeah, it's been a long journey. Well, how long did it take you to design the sound wire that, especially that portion with the XLR?

[00:09:01] I think that the whole XLR part was maybe like eight months. But yeah, like the whole, the whole kind of, you know, the whole project of when we started to work on the sound wire to when we finished, it was like about three years.

[00:09:17] You know, it wasn't actively every day, but just because you need always need to send an email, ask, you know, is this possible to do? And then you can wait, you know, like a few weeks and then, you know, follow up and all that.

[00:09:29] So, yeah, it's taken a while. Yeah. The design engineering part of it is always super slow, but worth it, man. You have a great product here. If people want to get their hands on the sound wire, how do they do that?

[00:09:43] So we sell the sound wire and the sound bullet either directly or through our dealers. And you can find out about all of this on our website, which is Sonect.com. And there you can find, you know, like, you know,

[00:10:01] how to get a ship to or if there's a dealer near you. So to purchase the sound wire, go to Sonect.com. That's S O N N E C T dot com. David, thanks for coming on and talking to us about the sound wire.

[00:10:16] It was a pleasure to be here. Thank you. Everyone knows that the Tech Arts podcast brings you information on exciting events that are happening in our communities. Before we continue with this podcast, I want to chat with you about an event called the Capture Summit.

[00:10:31] To help us with that discussion is the president of Metro Media and Communications Association, James Harding. Hey, James. Hey, David, how are you? I'm doing good, man. So tell us why Capture 24? Well, there's a lot of different things you could go to if you are a church

[00:10:46] creative, depending on what you do, if your media communications, graphic design, if you are a video producer. So why capture? Well, capture is definitely a place where these disciplines all kind of come together. And if you've ever just kind of been stuck in a rut,

[00:11:01] you just don't know what to do. You kind of feel like you're doing the same thing over and over again. Or maybe you've got demands that you're like, gosh, I don't know how to accomplish that.

[00:11:09] Capture is a great way to meet people that are doing what you do and can help give you ideas. You can build relationships there that you can turn to. Anytime you've got something that comes up where you're like, no, I just don't know how to do that.

[00:11:20] So you can study your discipline. You can build community. You can learn things. You can be encouraged. You can be lifted up. And what a better thing to do than attend a conference where you can have all that happen in the same place. It sounds like fun.

[00:11:32] Is that what the atmosphere is like? Is it a fun atmosphere? Tell us a little bit about the atmosphere. Yeah, I mean, you're going to gather 400 church creatives together in the same place. So, I mean, is that not fun? I think it's fun.

[00:11:43] So because I mean, one of the things that I've always loved is going to these things and just finding that one person that inspires me, you know, finding that person that, man, they've they've done something really cool.

[00:11:53] And I'm like the geeky little kid that wants to go be like, hi, will you be my friend? Because I want to I want to know what they do. I want to know how they do it.

[00:12:01] I want to learn how they do it because I want to do it too. So you gather 400 people that are, I say 400, 400 plus people that are all gathered with the same mindset, the same mentality that are just like us. Of course, it's going to be fun.

[00:12:13] You're going to be able to make jokes with people that actually understand the joke that you're making rather than just getting glossy eyed because they have no clue what you're talking about. And, you know, what a better place to be than that.

[00:12:24] Plus, you know, there's the reality of there's always somebody smarter than you about something. Right. So that's that's kind of cool, too, is just understanding that. Walk in knowing that so that you don't walk in going, oh, wow. I feel overwhelmed. No, don't feel overwhelmed.

[00:12:39] That's why everybody's there is because everybody wants to learn. Everybody wants to have a good time. There's no formality to it. There's no officialness to it. It's just a good time. It's just a great time to hang out, meet people, learn new things.

[00:12:51] Well, a little birdie told me that you're going to be speaking at this conference. You want to tell us a little bit about that? I am. I don't want to give away too much. So I will tell you that I am super passionate.

[00:13:01] You mentioned I serve as the president of M.M.C.A. I am super passionate about caring for people that do what we do, and especially caring for ministry leaders that are just in the trenches every single day.

[00:13:13] Then so I'm going to spend some time talking a little bit about some very important things that come along with that. Trying not to reveal too much, because I want you to come to the summit and hear it. But it's going to be good.

[00:13:26] You know, it's it's something I'm super passionate about. And it's definitely an encouragement that you need to know about because a lot of people in what we do just burn out. They fizzle out. They they run into roadblocks that they just feel like they can't overcome.

[00:13:40] And I'm going to share ways and some really basic things, but some very important things that you probably have overlooked and you probably don't have much regard for. But you need to. And so I'm going to share some things about that.

[00:13:52] They're going to help you in your ministry, help you lead your teams, help you just in general live a better life and be happier in what it is you're doing in the role you're serving at your local church.

[00:14:01] If you're looking for community, you want to sign up for Capture 24. So go to capture summit dot com. It's happening September 17th and 18th in Houston, Texas, at the Woodlands Church. If you want a conference where creativity thrives and Christ shines, you don't want to miss Capture 24.

[00:14:22] Go to capture summit dot com today. James, thanks for coming on and telling us about this amazing event. Hey, my pleasure. It's almost time for our interview with Buford Jones. You don't want to miss these amazing insights from a man

[00:14:35] who has mixed some of the biggest stars in the business. Hang on. That interview is coming up right after these messages from our sponsors. Thank you for listening to the Tech Arts Podcast. Be sure to tell all your friends about us.

[00:14:54] Give them the website, tech arts podcast dot com to find out more. More great content is coming up right after this. Our main sponsor is Digital Great Commission Ministries. Whether you need help building a team, finding the right gear, or just better understanding the church tech world,

[00:15:14] DGCM is here for you. Because they are a 501 C3 donor sponsored organization, they come to your church for free and do an assessment of your tech, visitor engagement and online streaming. Plus we give away free gear.

[00:15:32] Be sure to go to audio video lighting dot com and register your email today. This will sign you up for all of the free giveaways and give you first access to everything we offer for free. If you want free resources, training or consulting,

[00:15:48] contact Digital Great Commission Ministries today by going to audio video lighting dot com. That's audio video lighting dot com. Welcome back to the Tech Arts Podcast. For 47 years, this man has been a front of house engineer for groundbreaking acts in the history of concert touring.

[00:16:10] He has worked for ZZ Top, David Bowie, Eric Clapton, Pink Floyd, Linda Ronstadt, James Taylor, Jackson Brown, Faith Hill, George Harrison and many others. Oh my, that's a ton of artists. He's got quite a resume. He is one of the first to use a console with parametric EQ

[00:16:29] and was an early adapter of many other technical breakthroughs. In the early 1970s, he pioneered Mixed Reality. In the early 1970s, he pioneered mixing in stereo and was among the first to mix in quad, which he did for David Bowie's Young Americans Tour in 1974.

[00:16:48] In 1987, he was on the forefront of mixing in surround as he mixed for Pink Floyd's Delicate Sound of Thunder Tour. Please welcome to the Tech Arts Podcast, the legend, but more importantly, my friend, Buford Jones. Hey, Buford. Hello, my friend. Nice to be here.

[00:17:09] Thank you for having me, David. What a career. Is there anything that was special to you and some of those artists that I named, anything that happened that was special or anything that I missed? You know, when we did, uh, yeah, there's quite a few artists in there.

[00:17:22] There's 32 multiplatinum artists that I did at least one tour with. Many of those, uh, 32 artists, uh, there were multiple tours. So, uh, I think it boils down. And when I got the Parnelli lifetime award last month, uh, I once again,

[00:17:40] shocked myself and looking at that and looking at other resumes and said, did I really do that of these artists of that level? And it really happened. I, you know, I gave it a lot of course to, uh, the guidance

[00:17:55] that I said in my speech, I've always been blessed. I sometimes I'm trying to figure out why. I mean, what am I supposed to give back? Uh, because the Lord has blessed me throughout my career and even before

[00:18:08] my career, um, I've just seemingly had things handed to me on a silver platter, but without a doubt, uh, going walking in the show, go in 1970 with an electronics degree, uh, from a two year college that I went to

[00:18:22] there, um, it was just obviously for me, the perfect timing, perfect timing. It was a time I think after Woodstock and, uh, the whole, um, explosion of large PA systems going on the road. So, uh, that growth was just beginning between Claire brothers and Shoko.

[00:18:45] And I think at that time, for instance, in 1970, when I walked in the door at Shoko, uh, they had Led Zeppelin three dog nine and cat Stevens, and then, uh, Claire brothers had Elvin John and the moody blues. And it seemed like both companies were just mushrooming.

[00:19:03] They couldn't hire enough people fast enough. I thought it was almost, uh, funny in a way that, uh, at that time in 1970, we didn't have social media or anything else like that. So, uh, you know, uh, newspaper ads, they'd run some newspaper ads

[00:19:18] and classified for engineer at Shoko. And they'd get a lot of people in suits that would obviously really need to be applied at Texas instruments rather than, uh, with us. So we said, no, your hair needs to be a little longer and you need to wear a t-shirt.

[00:19:36] Now, uh, we, we, uh, when I walked in the door and the interesting thing that I've talked about many times, I did not know what Shoko was. I was working on the stereos is when I got out of college. So wait, wait, wait.

[00:19:50] You didn't, you didn't even know who Shoko was when you walked in the door to apply for the job. Absolutely not. And it's weird. What happened is, is I'm working in repair and stereos. I'd been there for a year, eight to five job. I was fine with that.

[00:20:06] It was interesting to me to set a high five equipment on the, on the bench and make it work as something I've done all my life. I give my father the credit on that because he was sort of similar in electronics and mechanics.

[00:20:19] And, uh, so yeah, I really enjoyed repairing stereos. And then a friend came by one day that I was talking to my hair was starting to get pretty long and it ended up being rusty Boucher's cousin.

[00:20:31] Rusty Boucher is one of the owners of Shoko and evidently rusty had told him that I'm looking for people. And, uh, so he said to me, are you interested in another job? I was as well if it pays more, I'm interested in it.

[00:20:46] And he says, we'll go down the street and talk to these people. But I had never heard of Shoko. I did not know what that was. Um, not even a clue. And so I went to Shoko.

[00:21:00] It was on Motor Circle at that time where they began and, uh, I went in and was interviewed by the three owners, Jack Max and Jack Calme is a rusty Boucher. They asked me several questions. They wanted to know if I had a degree. I said yes.

[00:21:15] And they, I told them I had a studio. This is that's great. You know how to hook up stuff and operate it. Yeah. Uh, play guitar. That's great. You're into music. Um, they asked me a couple of things and then they asked me if I was

[00:21:28] single and I still don't know really for sure what I'm going to do. And I was assuming I would be taking a bench job like I had at, uh, it's called Electra Mech is what it was called.

[00:21:43] And that's what I figured I'd be doing was doing bench work and soldering, even though I didn't know for sure what the company did. So when I saw these big four 15 bass bins in their shop, I was going,

[00:21:54] wow, I mean, the only thought in my mind is I should like to plug my guitar in that and Frank, that rattle some things. That'd be fun. And so I went in and I started, uh, the first day was wiring a,

[00:22:10] uh, a bell and 27 pair and connector wiring the cable to that. So I was doing that. And then, uh, Jack Maxson, my memory says it was the same day. Uh, it might've been the following day, but I think it was the same day.

[00:22:28] And Jack Maxson who had been mixing three dog night that was in there. Hey day, by the way, they were playing stadiums and he said, uh, go home, pack your bags. This is about two in the afternoon.

[00:22:40] Go home, pack your bags, get back down here, load this truck up and drive to Atlanta and you'll be on the three dog night tour. And I said, three dog night. That's a pretty big band. I've heard of them and he said, yep, just go get your stuff.

[00:22:51] And I did and drove that night to Atlanta. And that was my first time to see a show. Co PA set up. Uh, it was my first time to have anything to do with live music.

[00:23:04] Uh, my dad had built speakers for our church when I was a kid, but I never really got too involved in that. And, uh, but, uh, no, it's my first time to see a large scale PA. And so Jack Maxson was mixing and he did an incredible job.

[00:23:19] Um, I always remember the sounds that he achieved. Floyd's need the drummers, just a great drummer and, uh, really hard hitting. And Jack just had this super fat sound on him. Just true analog all the way through. And I've heard powerful and I remember the vocals

[00:23:40] and the power of the whole thing. And that embedded into me his sound. And then, uh, between this three dog night thing that I stayed on for almost a year before I began mixing, uh, that first year out took a supplemental PA to

[00:23:57] several Zeppelin gigs that were in the stadium and heard rusty Boucher mix. And, uh, once again, these guys really, uh, they're both worked in music and sound and knew what to do it. Jack Maxson had a radio studio and I think rusty, uh, played in

[00:24:17] a band with Jack Calme's and, um, they somehow put this PA together. I don't know all the history on that, but, uh, when they put it together, they did it the right way. I know that.

[00:24:28] And it was very, uh, sturdy belt to endure the traveling on the road. And, um, you know, in between, uh, some of these road trips, I may wire a little bit, but never spent a lot of time in the shop.

[00:24:48] In fact, that first year, uh, when I hired on, I think I, uh, maybe cut short when they asked me all those things, they asked me if I was single. And what does that got to do with anything? I'm 20 years old. Yeah, I'm single.

[00:25:04] Well, I found out a year later what that meant. And that really meant, yeah. Could you travel stay away and, uh, nobody's going to be, you know, trying to lure you back home. And, uh, yeah, yeah, I was ready to travel.

[00:25:20] I wanted to travel and got to see United States, man, tiny, uh, just drove this country left, right up and down. Um, yeah. At that time was playing weekends only sort of like a Nashville warrior type thing. They just went out on the weekend.

[00:25:37] So in the weekdays, we would be assigned to work with other groups and that could be the kinks. It could be, uh, it's a beautiful day. It could be the guess who, uh, it could be whatever.

[00:25:51] So I met a bunch of people in that first year and I was out 11 months out of that first year. Wow. Yeah. I almost forgot what home was like and, uh, to get there and, uh, you know,

[00:26:07] uh, mail stacking up, but I didn't have a lot of obligations then. So, you know, it's interesting about that time period. Uh, and it's, I find it kind of interesting that this happened to you. You came in and immediately you were wiring a cable.

[00:26:23] Now they put you out on the road pretty quick, but that was back in a time when you couldn't order things on the internet. You couldn't like buy your cables and, you know, buy your training manual or whatever you needed. You learned it all.

[00:26:36] You had to learn it all from learning and from learning. You had to learn all from learning. Now you had to learn it by networking. You had to learn by talking to people, by listening to the mix, by seeing how they did it.

[00:26:49] It wasn't all out there on the internet. And so I think it's really cool that your story and how you went out pretty quickly onto these tours and kind of learned by, you know, a fire hose of information coming at you.

[00:27:05] So it could be a lot of surprises, I think in ways. And yes, the norm is that I should have worked in the shop for a year or two. I think that's the way most of it happened.

[00:27:17] Other than me, maybe there was a strong need to have a position filled on the road and I just happened to walk in. So that introduced me to more people, but it's not typical of any sound company to do that.

[00:27:31] And if one walked in, even with experience of mixing, you still wouldn't do that. But then again, relationships and and, you know, it does happen that way. There's a lot of sound mixers that I would meet in the early 70s that were traveling with the bands.

[00:27:50] And one, for instance, was with a major act. I just won't mention the name at the moment, but there's so much feedback and it just sounded bad. And after a few days, I asked this gentleman when the kinks were out, what do you do?

[00:28:10] And he said he worked at the water department in London. So OK. And I could easily see that he did not know audio at all. And now, keep in mind, I knew the basics of audio when I went in at Showco

[00:28:27] and it all just made sense to me. I don't know. Everything made sense to me as I learned. I worked with another band. It's the same thing. Well, like this is easy top when I met them and the guy that was mixing

[00:28:42] again, a wonderful person that had no background. But he is a friend of the band. He was good friends with Billy Gibbons. And somehow here he is in mixed position for ZZ Top right before Trace Aubrey's went platinum. So that was while LaGrange was

[00:29:05] blowing up the map and he's mixing them then. And kind of the same situation. He was really struggling and I could tell he was extremely nervous. And I wanted to help him and try to take some of the pressure off. And the management was on him a lot.

[00:29:24] And I said, look, a couple of times I just reached over and grabbed something to try to help the process alone. And he seemed to appreciate that he had no problem with it. And after a couple of those kind of sessions,

[00:29:38] shows, then the manager told me he wanted me to mix it. And then they put the gentleman back on the stage and he had a stage position, which I think he was very relieved to take. That's a lot of tension. That's a lot of pressure,

[00:29:56] especially with a artist at that time that's got number one hits on the charts. And it's it's it's heavy pressure. And but still, this is an early time in our career when there wasn't schools and the places to go and learn the equipment

[00:30:18] and the whole principle of live touring. There are certainly many schools that came up later and did that. But which is a tremendous help, I think, in learning the background. My background really came all the way back to my dad, who built guitars. He made pedal steels.

[00:30:38] He rehaired bows. He would take a upright bass and tear it all apart, put it all back together again with clamps and what have you. I'd watch him do that. There wasn't his main occupation. He was a foreman at one of the refineries in Port Arthur, Texas.

[00:30:55] But when he went into refinery, he was in the shop and repairing and or building musical instruments. So that's where I kind of learned the fundamentals to play. And I think playing with my dad, one of the things that sounds so simple

[00:31:11] and basic, but I think it has a lot to do with me, is that I found that when I began to play guitar and he would he was a Chet Atkins Merle Travis fan and he wouldn't let me play with a pick.

[00:31:25] I had to play with my fingers, which is a good way to learn. And so as we played, and I think some of the fondest memories was when I moved to Dallas to go to college, I would go back to Port Arthur in six hour drive.

[00:31:40] And my dad and I were jam out in the garage. He had a pretty impressive garage. And I learned that as we did this more and more is great. And then he would invite some other players come over. Well, we didn't have a mixer.

[00:31:57] And I could do physical mixing then, which which means his amplifier there and my amplifier here. And this other person's here or there, wherever it is. I like to find the sweet spot, you know, where I can hear all of them,

[00:32:15] because without a doubt, your instrument, no matter the ability that you play with will sound better if somebody else is playing along with it. That's harmony. That's that's that's mixing, even though I wasn't pushing a fader. But I would do that.

[00:32:31] I'd slide around and I'd find that real comfort zone. And I hear the other players. And that stuck with me a lot. And I really analyze, I think when the artists come up there, I played in one, maybe two bands, but very shortly in high school.

[00:32:50] There again, I learned the composition of rock music. And now the layering of drums was always fascinating to me. I like just a big, powerful drum sound. So as I as I said, this came very easy to me out on the road.

[00:33:06] In fact, I noticed that everything was much higher quality than what I had been doing. But therefore it was mixing to me. I come in with a different approach to it, I think, then then a lot. And I, I,

[00:33:22] I look up there and I see a guitar or two guitars. And, you know, even before everything was in mono, I was already going to spread these guitars a little bit in the mix to give a bit of separation, to get a bit of

[00:33:38] more locality to the listener. There's the whole debate about stereo and mono PAs and quad and so on and so forth. Now we're in immersive systems. But oh, yeah, I don't think mono is the answer. It all depends on where you're at.

[00:33:54] There's only a few gigs I can name that would have the PAs set up in mono. But I was I was taking their original mixers that were modeled off of all take Lansing. I forget the model number of them. But they had two aux sends on them.

[00:34:10] And I find myself hooking up to PA to well, to the output, of course. And then I take those two aux sends and I run them to a tape machine. And that way I can do a stereo mix to the tape.

[00:34:24] And I listen to those tapes and another very controversial subject, which helped me tremendously throughout my career. We have to stop right there on today's podcast. But man, oh, man, I cannot wait to hear that insight on what tremendously helped Buford during his career.

[00:34:42] In order to hear it, you need to hang on for part two of this podcast, which is coming out very soon. Well, that wraps things up for today's episode. I can't wait to talk to you on the next Tech Arts Podcast until then.

[00:34:53] I'm David Loisner signing off by wishing you a great day and praying God blesses every moment of your week. See you soon. You have been listening to the Tech Arts Podcast presented by Digital Great Commission Ministries. DGCM is a 501 C3 nonprofit

[00:35:10] that was started to help churches with all things technical. Whether you need help building a team, finding the right gear or just a better understanding of the church tech world, DGCM is here for you. Find out more about our free on site visits, reports and consulting

[00:35:26] by going to audiovideolighting.com. Digital Great Commission Ministries will help you run your church service like a pro. Find out more at audiovideolighting.com.