[00:00:00] Welcome to the Healing for Male Survivors podcast. This is a podcast for male survivors of sexual
[00:00:09] abuse and assault, whether as a child or as an adult. Know that you are not alone and the
[00:00:16] abuse was not your fault. My name is Mike Chapman. I'm a certified recovery life coach
[00:00:22] and also a survivor. Let's find hope and healing together.
[00:00:29] And welcome to the Healing for Male Survivors podcast. This is Mike Chapman. And if you would like to join us live, please find all the
[00:00:40] information on how to do so on my website, polarlifeconsulting.com slash live. And we have a live
[00:00:48] audience with us with our special guest today, Nathan Spattery. And Nathan is an actor, filmmaker and child sexual
[00:00:59] abuse activist. After 25 years of hiding the secret of his sexual abuse beginning when he was eight, Nathan broke his
[00:01:07] silence and worked to overcome his childhood pain played out through adolescence and adulthood with sexual identity
[00:01:14] struggles, drug addiction and destructive behavior. His story is chronicled in his powerful memoir, Toy Cars, One
[00:01:22] Man's Journey from Trauma to Triumph. And for those of us who are here live, feel free to add your
[00:01:31] questions to the Q&A section. You can stay as anonymous as you would like. We will only state your name if you
[00:01:39] manually type it in along with your question. So to start things off, we begin with our segment, Four
[00:01:47] Questions. Now it's time for Four Questions, that part of the podcast when we get to know our guest a bit
[00:01:54] better by asking a few questions. Let's go. So Nathan, what is your favorite food memory?
[00:02:01] I think my favorite food memory is just being able to go back to Australia now living in, I
[00:02:08] live here in the States obviously. So being able to go back to Australia and just eat my mum's food,
[00:02:13] my mum's a fantastic cook so I love going back to Australia and just eating her food.
[00:02:21] She makes a lot of pastas and roasts and a lot of desserts, a lot of really good desserts and cakes
[00:02:27] and pastries and stuff like that. So it's, I don't eat it when I'm here, it's only when I go back
[00:02:31] to Australia so it's always really nice to go back and eat that food. Now remember from your
[00:02:36] book, you mentioned that she's from Malta area so growing up in that region south of Italy, north
[00:02:44] of Africa, what kind of food influences did she have and what does she tend to cook? More Italian
[00:02:50] or a whole mishmash or what? A bit of a mishmash but more Italian. I think the food is very
[00:02:56] influenced by Italian. The main dish in Malta is rabbit. So she makes a lot of rabbit dishes
[00:03:02] and rabbit stew and stuff so yeah it's a bit of a mishmash but it is more on the pasta, Italian
[00:03:09] side of stuff, side of food. So what's your absolutely favourite dish that she has made?
[00:03:15] She makes an amazing lasagna. She makes an amazing ravioli. She does all the pasta on her own from
[00:03:22] the start. She'll make all the pasta sheets, she'll make everything so yeah just I think
[00:03:26] she rolls out the pasta by hand. It sounds like that's a lot of work my goodness.
[00:03:33] But she loves it and bless her because she's good at it. Yeah so that's wonderful. So what is your
[00:03:39] favourite Christmas or holiday memory? Just being a kid and we have a beach house so the whole
[00:03:46] family would just go to the beach and over Christmas because it's summertime in Australia.
[00:03:50] I remember the night before there's a bunch of us kids all sleeping out in the living
[00:03:55] room waiting for Santa and at 2, 3, 4 in the morning one of our parents or our uncle would wake up
[00:04:02] and eat the carrots and drink the milk and stuff like that. And then in the mornings we'd get up
[00:04:07] and we'd go to the beach first thing then we'd go home and do the you know the presents and have
[00:04:13] a big Christmas lunch and then we'll go back to the beach so it's yeah just the simplicity
[00:04:19] of Christmas in Australia is you know it's hot, it's summer, it's beachy so it's great.
[00:04:25] Right well that's wonderful and what is your favourite church or house of worship memory?
[00:04:33] I think my favourite memory is just being able to go there during mass and get away from life
[00:04:39] just to be able to sit there in silence and just forget about everything
[00:04:43] and be in the moment and not have to worry about the outside world and what's going on.
[00:04:48] It was always you know that hour at mass was always a time just to get away from the world
[00:04:54] and get away from my struggles and get away from everything going on in my head
[00:04:58] and just to let it go for that hour. Yes I hear that a lot that church going to worship
[00:05:05] services yeah it gets you out of your head at least one hour a week and it's actually very
[00:05:11] healthy to think about something other than yourself and your worries and your troubles.
[00:05:17] So yeah that's fascinating but that's very common to find that relief really
[00:05:24] that yeah you don't have to think about stuff and you can just focus on the service and taking it
[00:05:29] all in so that's wonderful. So what is your favourite scripture or any inspirational quote
[00:05:35] that has helped you on your spiritual journey and what about it speaks to you?
[00:05:40] The one that really resonated with me was Psalm 35 which is Thou To Shall Pass
[00:05:44] and the reason why that resonated with me was because you know everything I've been through
[00:05:49] and the abuse and the trauma and that will pass that too shall pass and it's up to me to make
[00:05:57] the best of my life and to make the most of it so I can either sit in it, sit in that trauma
[00:06:03] and sit in that dark place or I can move forward with my life and let that pass let that be
[00:06:09] done let that be in a radio mirror. Right and you have used your story to help others by sharing it
[00:06:18] and you've got a wonderful story to tell and you've written a book including your story so briefly I mean
[00:06:24] don't want you to read all of your entire book but yeah let's hear about your story whatever you'd
[00:06:32] like to share I know some people's stories bounce around and I've only read part of your book
[00:06:36] I'm around chapter 20 now so I haven't gotten all the way to the end yes it's very fascinating
[00:06:43] your journey so and then from there we'll talk about your current healing journey and what you're
[00:06:50] doing these days. I obviously was born in Australia grew up in Canberra which is a capital city
[00:06:55] which is about three hour drive south of Sydney I kind of feel like during the summer the whole
[00:07:00] town would just go to the local swimming pool so me and my sister would ride our bikes down
[00:07:04] there and we'd done it plenty times before this one day my sister left halfway through the afternoon
[00:07:11] she went off with her friends and that was fine because I'd ridden my bike home plenty of times
[00:07:15] on my own and this one day at the end of the day I was literally the last person there at the pool
[00:07:21] this man followed me into the change rooms and he raped me in the shower first thing he said
[00:07:25] to me was that if I tell anyone he'll kill me and kill my family so I didn't tell a soul
[00:07:30] for 25 years and in this relationship with this man which went on for about six years it started
[00:07:36] out very rough and violent and he would you know throw me against the wall and choke me out and make
[00:07:40] me pee my pants and beat me up and hit me and punch me and slap me and you know rape me very
[00:07:45] violently but then through his grooming and his manipulation it turned into a Stockholm
[00:07:49] syndrome type relationship where I felt love for him to the point where I'd ride my bike down
[00:07:53] to his house and wait for him outside to get home and that's when he would be violent
[00:07:56] with me again because I was waiting for him he abandoned me or he disappeared out of my life
[00:08:02] after those five six years and then I you know for a year or two I questioned who I was what I was
[00:08:06] where I belong in the world who do I belong with am I gay am I straight at 15 years old I would
[00:08:11] ride my bike to cruise lounges and sex clubs and gay clubs in the suburb next to mine which
[00:08:16] was an industrial estate I would sneak into these places I would let these men abuse me
[00:08:22] and rape me again and then I would turn around and beat them up and bash them and rob them
[00:08:25] and that was my fuck you the world my way of getting my power back my way of feeling alive
[00:08:30] that went on for quite a few years as well and as a result of that I fell in with the wrong crowd
[00:08:36] doing drugs you know selling my body for sex shooting heroin smoking crack trying to kill
[00:08:41] him myself almost killed someone else so you know that was a big part of my life for a very long
[00:08:46] time I was then invited to New York to study and become an actor I came to New York thinking
[00:08:52] I could get away from that life and start over and start fresh but it's New York City and you know
[00:08:58] you can get what you want when you want how you want it twice as cheap as anywhere else and fell
[00:09:02] back into it and everything I did before the drugs or sex of violence to the point where I
[00:09:07] most killed myself again and I knew it was now or never I knew it was time everyone was abandoning
[00:09:11] me everyone didn't want to be my friend anymore and I finally was able to talk to my best friend
[00:09:16] and ask her to meet me one last time because she was done with me too she met with me at a
[00:09:20] cafe I still couldn't get the words out but then she finally you know she was about to stand up and
[00:09:24] leave and I grabbed her and I said I was raped as a kid and that was the first time I ever said those
[00:09:29] words she helped me find a therapist through therapy I did group therapy rehab AA narcotics
[00:09:34] sex synonymous and the past 12 13 years of my healing journey have been me kind of understanding
[00:09:40] my relationship with this man understanding my relationship with my parents with friends with
[00:09:44] lovers finding peace finding forgiveness for myself but what I you know what was put on me
[00:09:49] and what what I put on the waters for the hurt I put on two others and and understanding that it
[00:09:54] wasn't my fault which was a big part of my healing journey was understanding it wasn't my fault
[00:10:00] that's where big weights fell off me and one of the biggest things was just owning who I am
[00:10:06] owning my shit owning the good the bad the ugly owning all of it because once I owned all
[00:10:12] of us that allowed me to get my power back that allowed me to move forward that allowed me
[00:10:17] some kind of peace some kind of closure some kind of of understanding of what I went through
[00:10:25] right I've gotten through a lot of your book it's interesting yeah you mentioned the Stockholm
[00:10:30] syndrome but after the instance with the what you call the man which I kind of appreciate it
[00:10:36] I know in the no longer ashamed podcast Daniel had come on to talk about using terms other
[00:10:43] than my abuser and in the book you just talk about the man which I appreciate now you started
[00:10:50] seeking out those behaviors kind of stalking him to see when he was there when he was not
[00:10:56] and actually seeking that out on I think that's a very normal behavior part of the grooming
[00:11:02] they groom you to believe and I like you you said brainwash you into believing that you
[00:11:08] want this and that it's something you gave permission for that you convincing you that
[00:11:19] yeah you like this and that it's special or whatever and that's also very common I noticed
[00:11:27] a later chapters you talk about frequency in sex clubs and so forth and after acting out with
[00:11:34] whoever you would hook up there you would end up violently hitting them and then leaving
[00:11:42] just like punching them whatever and that seemed to be a pattern with you did you ever figure out
[00:11:48] what was behind that why did you just knock them out or push them around get a little bit violent
[00:11:54] after everything was over and then leave did you ever find out what was behind that
[00:12:00] yeah because I wasn't these men that I was hitting it wasn't these men that I was acting
[00:12:04] out on I was on my my views up for abandoning me for just disappearing out of my life because
[00:12:11] I was so lost and confused and he told me he loved me and we're gonna be together forever and
[00:12:16] and you know all of that stuff so I had so much anger and hatred inside of myself
[00:12:24] right for myself because of what he said to me through his grooming manipulation imposter syndrome
[00:12:30] self sabotage I don't deserve love I don't deserve happiness I deserve to fail I deserve to
[00:12:36] you know to be in the gutter and to be a piece of shit I you know that's what I deserved and
[00:12:40] that's who I was so I acted on that and that was all I knew for a very long time and acting
[00:12:48] out with these men and beating these men up and hitting them and robbing them and doing what
[00:12:52] I was doing was the only way I was able to feel that again and and feel those emotions and feel
[00:12:58] that's the way the man made me feel right you know the first nine years of my sexual life
[00:13:04] from eight to seventeen I was being abused and raped by men and beaten up and this sat in the
[00:13:08] other first time I had sex with a woman was when I was 17 so you know for a very long time
[00:13:13] for those nine years that was all I knew and that was all I I had in my life right so I
[00:13:19] act out on that and again that's what made me feel alive that's what made me feel or gave me back my
[00:13:26] power right yeah they became a proxy for the man and all your feelings for towards the man
[00:13:35] exactly so yeah is a way to get out all of that and it kept you alive and it really gave
[00:13:41] you that outlet at least not that it was terribly healthy but it got you through it
[00:13:46] um for sure now in New York you told your friend about your story when was the first time you told
[00:13:55] your story publicly in any kind of public forum and how did that come about I went back to Australia in
[00:14:01] 2018 my sister's husband passed away he had cancer so he died I went back for for the
[00:14:07] funeral and I was back home for two to three weeks a very good friend of mine is a journalist
[00:14:12] for one of the major newspapers in Australia and this was a time when there was a big kind of royal
[00:14:19] commission on abuse in the Catholic Church abuse in the Boy Scouts you know a lot of that in these
[00:14:28] organizations or in these institutions sexual abuse towards towards boys and young boys and girls
[00:14:36] so the Prime Minister of Australia was doing this big public apology to all victims and and trying to
[00:14:43] help them find some peace and you know get closure and move forward so my friend who was a journalist
[00:14:48] said Nathan can I do a story on you and I was like oh I don't know I I I don't know I don't
[00:14:55] know if I want this to come out but then I thought you know what yeah I know because this is going
[00:14:59] to help me in my healing but it could help so many other people and I remember speaking to my
[00:15:03] parents about it speaking to my mum and mum said well if it happens can you can you keep it anonymous
[00:15:08] do you have to put your name in a photo and I spoke to my friend the journalist and she said well we
[00:15:13] have to because otherwise it's anonymous made up article that could would have no credit but
[00:15:19] because it's about you it's about this young boy who grew up in this small town and who is now
[00:15:23] living in New York and working as an actor and a writer and a producer it adds so much more
[00:15:28] credit to it because it just shows what what one can overcome so that's it came out Halloween weekend
[00:15:35] in Australia October 31st and it just kind of grew from there. Wow I know I remember hearing
[00:15:42] about the commission when all the information about Hillsong which is also based in Australia
[00:15:46] came out and I think yeah they were probably similarly investigated and I think it was a
[00:15:52] Boy Scout incident that was some of the early evidence in that case as well and then it's
[00:15:58] snowballed and there's even more that have been released yeah now that eventually led you to writing
[00:16:05] the book which will have the links to the show notes and when you wrote the book what was the
[00:16:13] hardest part about writing that book and what was the best part of writing that book? That's a
[00:16:19] great question no one has ever asked me that. The only times that I cried in writing that book
[00:16:25] if I can remember correctly the hardest part was when I was writing about my family my parents and
[00:16:30] my siblings. Writing about the abuse and what was done to me I think because I'd written about it so
[00:16:36] many times in therapy that it wasn't the first time that it it wasn't you know it didn't trigger
[00:16:41] me so much but writing about my family and my parents and how sweet and good they are and
[00:16:48] this that and the other that's what got me that's what broke my heart best part was
[00:16:52] the last few chapters because obviously you've got the four main chapters before him with him
[00:16:57] after him today I think the best part was writing the today part and
[00:17:05] writing about how far off come and what I've actually learned now and what I want to give
[00:17:10] back to the world that was I think that was the best part was first three quarters of the
[00:17:15] book was tough and hard and it was very dark and deep and you know all of that stuff
[00:17:22] but the last quarter was just me about what I've learned where I am today what I'm doing today
[00:17:29] and my healing journey and I think that was the best part because it made me realize just how
[00:17:35] I guess how far I have come and how much I have learned and how much I have evolved and grown
[00:17:40] and and developed as a person now you mentioned talking about your family were you able to contact
[00:17:47] family and friends when writing the book and getting their perspective on the book yeah well
[00:17:52] when I wrote the book that was probably two years after the article came out I think
[00:17:57] or about a year and a half article came out in 2018 it was mid 2019 that's the publishing
[00:18:05] house reached out to me to asking me to write my memoir then I started writing it towards
[00:18:10] the beginning of 2020 so it was about a year a little over a year so in that time my family
[00:18:17] obviously found out my family knew my friends knew everyone kind of knew about my story now
[00:18:22] because it was out there to the world so my family were very I asked my family I asked my friends
[00:18:27] a ton of questions and they were all very responsive and all very helpful and you know
[00:18:32] we had a laugh about a few things and and you know a bit of a cry about a few other things but it was
[00:18:39] very cathartic and therapeutic in writing it on my own but also in speaking to family and friends
[00:18:47] and ex-girlfriends and lovers and what not about everything else right and getting their
[00:18:53] perspective on your story as well probably put a new light on things absolutely because there's
[00:18:59] my side there's their side and then there's the truth and I think their side was more
[00:19:05] the truth so it was great to get their side of it and write that because obviously it was so long
[00:19:12] ago and you know a lot of these things that happened were I was so messed up on drugs or
[00:19:17] depressed or whatever I was so my memory of it was not was not the greatest so to be able
[00:19:24] to speak to these people I spoke to drug dealers I spoke to people I partied with I spoke to
[00:19:30] everyone and anyone that I could fascinating listening to your book I've been listening
[00:19:36] to the audio version you mentioned the man what ever happened to him I haven't gotten that far in
[00:19:43] the story that he somehow vanished and then there was family members who came and you saw them
[00:19:50] and basically explained that you were not going to see him again did you ever find out what happened
[00:19:56] to him I don't know exactly because his family didn't tell me and I was so young at that time
[00:20:02] but I know he's dead now I know he's dead now he got early onset Alzheimer's dementia and died
[00:20:09] I was told that there was more than one kid or more than me and it normally is that way if
[00:20:13] it happens to one it's there's normally a lot of a lot of kids and when they explain to me that
[00:20:18] you're never going to see him again I never did see him again so I'm not sure if he got in
[00:20:22] trouble with the police or his family found out and then he had to go away or he just disappeared
[00:20:28] or he left town but that's what I was told because my mom yes she was from Malta but my mom
[00:20:33] moved to Australia when she was like two years old and mum grew up in this town so the way
[00:20:38] I found out one of the reasons well how I found out about him and his name was I had a big
[00:20:44] article come out about me in a newspaper in Australia like let's just say like the New York
[00:20:48] Times of Sydney Morning Herald which is one of the biggest papers there my mum and her friends got
[00:20:52] together because there was always talk of some you know some some man in the town who who did
[00:20:58] no good things or who were you know we're not we're not nice and or who were pedophiles so
[00:21:02] mum and you know my mum and her friends put their heads together and kind of worked out who
[00:21:08] it was where he lived what he looked like and you know with my help and kind of looked at oh
[00:21:12] my god that's this guy that's his name this is who he is and he's now dead so I never saw him after
[00:21:19] that I never saw him after he disappeared after I was 12 years old and which is kind of hard because
[00:21:24] people say well now you have closure but not really yes he's gone yes he's dead but I don't really
[00:21:29] have the closure that I want or I need right yeah wow was that part of your book did you add
[00:21:35] that to the book it's all in the book at the end yeah yeah okay all right all right more to come
[00:21:40] I'm not there yet now we do have some questions from the audience Dan Carlson says I'm impressed
[00:21:47] with your TED Talk mate I'm glad to be here to hear you and yes you had did a TED Talk recently
[00:21:54] I know talking about your story so what happened what's the story behind you getting on TED Talk
[00:22:00] were you invited or did you apply or how does that even work yeah I had a lot of friends
[00:22:05] telling me that I should be doing a TED Talk I need to do a TED Talk so I was introduced
[00:22:10] to this coach and he was an amazing man and he and I you know had a few meetings about it and who I
[00:22:16] am and I told him my story he read my book and he was like Nathan you need to do this you really
[00:22:21] need to do this TED Talk because it could be super powerful and you could really help thousands
[00:22:25] of people so I wrote the TED Talk I wrote the script first or I wrote the TED Talk and then he
[00:22:31] kind of come in and helped me fine tune and get it to where it needs to be and then we are
[00:22:35] applied we applied to about 60 TED Talks and I got one it was in Dallas and I did it and
[00:22:49] you know if I can say so myself I nailed it I did really well with it and it's about all
[00:22:53] about how I broke up with my abuser and how I broke up with the shame the anger the toxic
[00:23:00] masculinity the ego that the drugs and you know about and then talking about education and and
[00:23:07] moving forward and stuff like that so it went very very well and I'm really glad I had that
[00:23:13] experience and I'm glad it's out there for the world to see and and you know I hope that the
[00:23:18] listener can and the person who watches it can can learn from it and get some healing from it
[00:23:24] and what I really like about it the most is that a lot of people who watch it will reach out
[00:23:29] and say Nathan I was never abused I've never been sexually abused but what you spoke about
[00:23:34] and breaking up with ego and shame and anger and hatred and toxic masculinity related to me so much
[00:23:40] that I've taken on board what you've said and it's the same with the book I've had so many
[00:23:45] females reach out to me saying Nathan I've never been through anything you've been through
[00:23:49] I've never been abused or sexually abused but because of your book the way I now speak to
[00:23:55] my children the way I speak to my husband my partner what I want in a partner has completely
[00:24:01] changed because of because of your book and that's what I love the most is that I can you know as
[00:24:06] much as I can impact survivors I can impact people from all walks of life as well and that's
[00:24:12] that's what I really enjoy about this definitely and I know you have this book and the audio
[00:24:20] book and so forth and what else is going on with your story it sounds like you've got more
[00:24:28] in line than just having your book published yeah I've been starting to do a lot of talks
[00:24:36] a lot of keynotes which has been great and I really enjoy and going to universities or going to
[00:24:42] organizations or whatever the situation or charity events or whatnot so doing that which I'm
[00:24:47] really starting to enjoy but through the the memoir and through the TED talk I was asked to do
[00:24:54] a documentary on my story which I've I'm out it which is done now which I've done it is now doing
[00:25:00] a festival circuit and you know we have high hopes with it it's pretty powerful and you know we're
[00:25:05] hoping to get it into the Oscars in the short film documentary category it's you know that
[00:25:10] that has to be under 40 minutes to qualify our documentary is 39 minutes so it gets there
[00:25:16] and so that's now doing the festival circuit I just sent you the the trailer for it which
[00:25:21] I'm excited by and can I share that link in the show notes as well Nathan? Of course please
[00:25:27] memoir is now being turned into a movie uh the script is being written it's with producers
[00:25:31] with line producer and we're really getting the team together and what I really enjoy and find
[00:25:37] fascinating is that or I'll meet with producers and people who are interested in being a part of it
[00:25:42] and I tell them my story and the first thing they say is I need to be a part of this or I want to
[00:25:48] be a part of this I want to help I want to do what I can I'll reduce my rates you can pay me on
[00:25:54] the back end but literally everyone who I've spoken to producers about it are like yep I'm
[00:26:00] in I want to do this I had one producer who said her brother was raped as a kid and it really messed
[00:26:07] him up and he is still really messed up so she has a really big interest in it and wants to be a part
[00:26:13] of it so we know that you know if this movie is done right it could really have a huge impact
[00:26:19] in the world and create a lot of change and be super successful so there's a lot of things going
[00:26:24] on you know from something so bad that has happened to me and this is all stuff I never
[00:26:28] wanted to do the book the memoir you know the documentary the Ted talk the movie this is all
[00:26:33] stuff I never wanted to do but through my healing journey and understanding the impact I can have
[00:26:39] on people the growth I can have for myself especially more importantly you know from something so bad
[00:26:46] to now something amazing has has come about that so I you know it's it's definitely been a journey
[00:26:52] and it's it's been a tough one and you know like I said you know suicidal ideations and wanting to kill
[00:26:57] myself and hurting a lot of people and hurting myself to now coming out the other side of it
[00:27:03] and understanding who I am and understanding my life to now be able to move forward and and to
[00:27:08] really kind of hopefully have an impact on the world right where did you go from telling your
[00:27:15] friends telling your therapist getting help to I want to share this publicly how did you
[00:27:21] make that leap therapist would tell me ask me all these questions and at that time I wasn't
[00:27:26] be I wasn't able to talk about it so my therapist would write down a bunch of questions for me I
[00:27:32] would go home and write the answers and we'd talk about it the next week and I realized I had pages
[00:27:38] upon pages upon pages of this of my story and I showed it to my best friend and even my therapist
[00:27:45] said Nathan you need to do something with this you could change the world with this
[00:27:48] and then it just kind of grew from there and and that's where it where it all began
[00:27:55] oh so yeah you just started to share bits of your story and then it kept piling up and you
[00:28:01] realized you know this is a lot of stuff wow yeah um and that's one of the overwriting themes of
[00:28:10] this podcast is the power of story and you have a very powerful story and you're using
[00:28:17] that power to make huge change and I think the more public we can make this idea about
[00:28:30] survivors of abuse especially male survivors I think that's going to really change the
[00:28:37] tide and help more men heal and the more men who hear other men tell their story of abuse
[00:28:46] and survival that they will be inspired to share and that's what happened to me
[00:28:54] I heard the Leaving Neverland documentary and that inspired me on my own healing journey
[00:29:01] and getting to the point where I could share publicly and then others appeared my story
[00:29:06] and they're getting help and people are hearing their story and they're getting help so it's
[00:29:11] just this snowball effect and very excited to see how this goes with you Q&A I've got another one
[00:29:20] Ed says when you mentioned imposter syndrome exactly I felt my story was not important because
[00:29:28] I wasn't abused enough that some people think oh well I just had this little abuse and you have
[00:29:35] this big abuse but like I say it's not a contest and it's all bad and it all does so much damage
[00:29:43] it is and trauma is all relative you know whether you've been through like like Ed said you've been
[00:29:48] through one little thing a small amount of abuse or you've been through a large amount of abuse
[00:29:52] it's all about how you deal with it it's all about how you handle it you know I've been
[00:29:56] through what I've been through and I've come out the other side you can go through the smallest
[00:29:59] amount of abuse it's the worst thing in the world and you want to kill yourself you just want to
[00:30:02] you know it destroys you so again it's all about being able to just share your story with someone
[00:30:09] because ultimately that's all we want is for someone to listen to us someone to hear us
[00:30:14] someone to believe us someone to support us and love us and hug us and kiss us and be there
[00:30:19] for us that's that's what we want so it doesn't matter how small or how big your story is
[00:30:25] it's about talking about it getting it out finding that support system and having them
[00:30:30] be able to just be there for you and help you through that journey and move forward in that
[00:30:35] journey it doesn't matter how big the trauma is or the abuse is it's about what you do with it
[00:30:41] and you can let it destroy you or you can let it empower you get your power back move forward
[00:30:47] and grow and become the person you're supposed to become that's what it's about
[00:30:52] another thing from Dan Carlson I really identify with you on many points mate
[00:30:58] I finally stepped into the persona that had been locked kept locked away and fed on fear
[00:31:05] and shame and anger when I was 57 and dove into the fetish community as the dominant
[00:31:13] sato masochist abuser of submissive men when I finally got my CPTSD diagnosed
[00:31:20] and began therapy the concept of it wasn't my fault really began to be something I could understand
[00:31:29] much love to you brother I get it absolutely yeah no I fell into that world too of you know the
[00:31:37] the sex world and for me through the shame and the imposter syndrome and the self sabotage
[00:31:43] you know I was trying to date women but I would then sneak around and have
[00:31:47] sex with men from like I said from the earliest age of 15 I wanted these men to abuse me I wanted
[00:31:52] these men to rape me half the time I wanted them to not wear a condom and I wanted to catch something
[00:31:57] I wanted to get paid I wanted to die because that's what I deserved and that's right that's that
[00:32:04] was who I who I was or who I am and you know like I said that that took over my life for a very
[00:32:10] long time and touch wood you know I should be dead I should be in jail I should be on the
[00:32:15] street somewhere but but someone's looking out for me someone's watching over me and someone's
[00:32:20] taking me on this journey you know that's something now that I'm embracing and and moving
[00:32:24] forward with and just what happened to me it didn't kill me and there's a reason why it
[00:32:28] didn't kill me and as to now share my stories to educate the world it's to really create
[00:32:34] change and create something amazing right yes for sure got another response I understand
[00:32:42] the anger you're talking about how we take it out on the ones who love us the most I feel so guilty
[00:32:49] about this the patience our loved ones must have a place in heaven I have a hard time forgiving
[00:32:56] myself mood swings especially thank you so much for your transparency and courage yeah you know
[00:33:04] like what's it saying says you always hurt the ones you love the most
[00:33:08] and you do because they're the ones who care for you and want you to to share and communicate
[00:33:15] and be vulnerable and but we don't want to do that until we're ready to do it and I did it the same
[00:33:21] you know my family and they would always ask me what is wrong and what's going on because as a
[00:33:25] kid I would just as a teenager I would just sit at home and just cry and not talk to anyone
[00:33:31] and my parents would ask and my sister would ask and all I would say is you don't understand
[00:33:39] you wouldn't understand don't worry about it I'm okay but in the meantime I'm trying wanting to kill
[00:33:44] myself and I'm wanting to just be alone and be depressed and it's interesting because the very
[00:33:50] first time I told my mother after she asked her you know the who the what the when the where
[00:33:54] questions all of that stuff the very first thing she said after that was wow that explains
[00:34:00] everything about you now I understand why you were the young boy that you were in a teenager and
[00:34:07] you were so all over the place and just the drugs and all of that now it all makes sense
[00:34:13] right until I was able to be open and vulnerable and share they were pulling their hair out going
[00:34:20] what the fuck is wrong with this kid what is wrong we're trying to help but he doesn't want
[00:34:24] he doesn't want to help and I didn't want to help for a very long time until I until I was ready
[00:34:30] and it took me a long time to be ready for it so you know when I did it changed my life and and now
[00:34:35] I have such a close relationship with my parents and with my brothers and my sister and you know
[00:34:40] before I didn't but now I love going to spend time with them and you know I've got little niece
[00:34:45] and nephews and they're my life they're my heart and and you know any chance I get to go back
[00:34:50] to Australia and see them then that's that they make it all worthwhile right now wanted to see
[00:34:57] you're in the Hollywood realm I know you're an actor and you're in LA pursuing getting your movie
[00:35:05] made and so forth what is your opinion on all the latest Hollywood scandals like with Nickelodeon
[00:35:14] and Drake Bell coming out of all these other celebrities it's tough because it's all about
[00:35:20] money and power and it's all about saving face so you know what I find the most disappointing
[00:35:26] about all of this is how many actors or celebrities are coming out and supporting the abuser and saying
[00:35:35] they're okay and saying they're good people and saying it's a lie because they don't want to lose a
[00:35:41] job or they don't want to you know upset the person because he's a big executive and he can get
[00:35:48] them a job or two so I'm as an actor is I'm gonna say what he did we would say it wasn't that
[00:35:54] bad or it's not true or whatever just to save face so I can get my next acting job or whatever the
[00:35:59] situation was or because I did a job with him a few years ago and he and I thought he was a good person
[00:36:04] that's what I find most disappointing is you really learn who these people are and what's
[00:36:10] important to them and where their values lie and a lot of them don't care because when my memoir
[00:36:15] came out my PR management team at the time would go to these media outlets to a lot of
[00:36:20] media outlets and say here's this amazing book or whatever the situation is and 95% of the time the
[00:36:26] media would say if Nathan was a woman we would talk to him today because he's a man we're not
[00:36:30] going to talk to him because we don't want to talk about male sexual abuse we're going to pretend
[00:36:34] male sexual abuse doesn't exist that's what's wrong with the world today is that we need
[00:36:38] to change that we need to start educating these people because it's still such a taboo
[00:36:43] subject it's still such a stigma surrounding male sexual abuse and let's just pretend it doesn't
[00:36:49] exist and move forward yeah I'm so thankful for Drake Bell and Anthony Edwards and uh all those
[00:36:57] other celebrities who have come out in the past few years since really the me too movement
[00:37:03] talking about their abuse openly because that's how other men realize they're not alone let's
[00:37:10] like I said earlier the power of story so I'm very thankful about that and I know
[00:37:16] also we had Craig hiding on the podcast recently and he mentioned his play Guilt
[00:37:22] which I know you guys just did a read through and you play the Craig character the character
[00:37:27] that's based on his life so how did that go and what is the plans moving forward for that play
[00:37:37] went very well I had to lead I played Craig and and what it's about is a man who is trying to
[00:37:44] or he doesn't have much of a relationship with his wife and his daughter and he can't open up
[00:37:48] and he can't communicate you can't tell him what happened to him and he has these memories come back
[00:37:52] and about his past and stuff and he finally opens up at the very end it went really well we are
[00:37:57] now hopefully we have a grant and we are able to move forward with it but we're looking for
[00:38:02] producers when we're looking for a theater so that we can put it up and go on a run and
[00:38:06] and do it here and then hopefully we can take it to New York and take it to other places
[00:38:10] and really yeah get it out there and because it's a great play it's very well written and
[00:38:15] but you know just like any movie doing a play is just as hard as well because it's all about money
[00:38:19] it's all about finding those investors who want to invest in a story like this
[00:38:25] but we're very optimistic and we've got some good people on board now and hopefully
[00:38:28] we it happens and it works out now how was it for you going through this script and playing
[00:38:34] this character knowing that so much of it paralleled your own journey you know it's fine
[00:38:40] because people ask me about my script my movie script as well and and what I told them and what I
[00:38:45] come to realize is I've done so much work on myself and I'm continuing to do the work it's
[00:38:50] an everyday thing it's not like I do six months of therapy in that then I'm all healed
[00:38:55] I'm continuing to do all this work on myself that I I understand it I understand how it works
[00:39:01] it doesn't trigger me anymore like I don't read something and I I fall to the floor and end up in
[00:39:07] a corner just shaking or that that doesn't happen anymore it can be a little exhausting sometimes
[00:39:12] but for me now I understand it and I am I enjoy telling these stories I enjoy being a part of it
[00:39:19] because I understand it and I understand the impact it could make so I want to make sure
[00:39:24] these stories are told correctly so that's yeah that's really important to me is is is getting
[00:39:29] these stories out and telling them the right way excellent but is it helping your healing process
[00:39:34] as well it does I learn every day from it and I grow and I you know I I get to understand a bit more
[00:39:42] and and what I loved about group therapy was hearing everyone else's stories because it wasn't my
[00:39:49] story but I could relate to so much of it just like you with my book and and other people with
[00:39:53] my book telling one story or listening to someone else's story it's very much therapeutic
[00:39:59] because you are learning so much from everyone else and what they went through
[00:40:03] and how they handled it and how they felt and you're like oh yes I did that I felt that I went
[00:40:10] through the same thing so it's it's great I find it all very therapeutic and very learning and
[00:40:15] and I enjoy I really enjoy that process yes I know I've mentioned on the podcast on previous
[00:40:21] episodes that artistic expression is a very right-brained activity and trauma is stored in the
[00:40:32] right brain and so oftentimes if you're expressing yourself artistically you can often tap into
[00:40:42] that part of the dream that part of the brain that experience the trauma and help to release it
[00:40:50] in different ways that you couldn't otherwise through non-artistic expression so I'm wondering the
[00:40:57] fact that you are playing these characters and playing these words but also trying to
[00:41:04] understand that character as well and that's a whole big I've been into drama as well so I know
[00:41:10] there's a whole process of trying to understand the character and then expressing and so forth
[00:41:16] tapping into those emotions and so forth so you can properly portray that I'm wondering if you are
[00:41:23] tapping into those traumas as well I am yeah when I when I act and when I'm creating a character or
[00:41:30] when I'm reading a script I always bring my past traumas into it because that allows me to then
[00:41:36] go there and go deep and really portray this character and really put the words on the page
[00:41:42] with with real heart and real depth and real life instead of just reading the words I can feel the
[00:41:48] words I can feel the character I know what he's gone through and I bring my my past to it my my
[00:41:53] memories yeah it makes for a better performance it makes for a better understanding wonderful
[00:41:59] we've got a few more questions Nathan thanks for everything you've done and continue to do
[00:42:04] excellent Ted talk really appreciate your outlook on life and thanks for speaking
[00:42:10] truth and I will amen to that for sure and we have another follow-up from Ed by telling my story he says
[00:42:20] I discovered I was actually significantly abused but I tucked it away so just by the process of
[00:42:28] telling the story it unlocked more memories for him did you experience anything like that as well
[00:42:35] as you continued on your journey telling your story and now documentary so forth every time you
[00:42:41] tell your story every time something comes up every time you speak about it not always not always I
[00:42:47] should say but a lot of the times other memories would come or other things would show up or
[00:42:52] I'd feel or I'd hear or I'd remember right you know it yeah it's always a a journey of self-discovery
[00:43:00] and sometimes you'll discover a lot more when you tell one side of the story and sometimes
[00:43:03] you won't discover as much so it all just depends on where you're at and what part of the story you're
[00:43:07] telling and and stuff like that so yes for me sometimes I discovered a lot other times it was
[00:43:14] just just that I did want to ask you mentioned relationships a lot in your book and so forth
[00:43:20] where are you now in that journey do you currently have any relationships going on I'm single at
[00:43:26] the moment I'm single and I'm open to it and I'm looking a lot I'm looking but I'm open to
[00:43:31] I'd love to meet with someone I'd love to be in a relationship but right now I'm
[00:43:37] comfortable with being alone because I've just got so much work going on and you know I'm growing
[00:43:42] every day so you know when I do meet that person hopefully it's right and I'm ready to open up
[00:43:47] and really give give everything to them right that sounds wonderful and look forward to getting
[00:43:53] more information about where you're going with all of this all of this information with
[00:43:59] the documentary I just watched the trailer for that that looks very fascinating and the upcoming
[00:44:06] movie that I'm excited to hear more about as well thank you everyone once once I know things and once
[00:44:12] things come out and things are I'll I'm happy to share it with you and on my social media and
[00:44:18] fun only look forward to that any closing thoughts Nathan oh it's just you know it's
[00:44:23] always nice to be here and you know you and I have known each other for a while now and
[00:44:26] I've spoken and it's just nice to do this with you and be a part of this community and to really
[00:44:31] you know help those who don't have a voice and facilitate their healing journey and if I can
[00:44:37] do that if I can be a part of that then what an amazing legacy to leave so I'm you know I'm happy
[00:44:42] to be here I'm happy to do this and let's do it again in another six months or another year
[00:44:46] and when things have evolved and when the movie's out in the documentary and all that stuff
[00:44:50] and we can talk more we thrilled to have you back thank you so much for sharing your story
[00:44:55] Nathan and again if you would like to join us on this podcast on future episodes feel free to go
[00:45:02] to my website polarlifeconsulting.com slash live if you would like to learn more about my coaching
[00:45:11] with polar live consulting where I provide one-on-one coaching and group coaching both
[00:45:17] with a focus on healing for male survivors reach out to me at polarlifeconsulting.com
[00:45:24] that is polar spelled P-O-L-A-R I would love to hear from you I want to hear your story if you
[00:45:31] would like your story featured on this podcast contact me via my website if you'd like this podcast
[00:45:37] please rate and review because that's how other people can find me and I really want to spread
[00:45:42] this message of healing and hope to others and remember you are not alone healing is possible
[00:45:49] and the abuse was not your fault let me repeat that the abuse was not your fault see you next time on
[00:45:58] the healing for male survivors podcast