Football and Faith with Jim Daly - Pres of Focus on the Family

[00:00:00] The horse is prepared for battle, but victory comes from the Lord. So I'm dependent on the Lord. Day by day, one play at a time. That's the message. I am so happy and grateful that the Lord has blessed me to play in some snow, to be in true football weather today, to give Him the glory.

[00:00:17] The following is a presentation of Hobson Media.

[00:00:20] Woo hoo!

[00:00:29] This is the Church Pew Sports Podcast, featuring a group of pastors delivering bombastic takes on sports, life and faith.

[00:00:37] We're going to attack this day with an enthusiasm unknown to mankind.

[00:00:43] Take a knee.

[00:00:44] Man, it's hard to break us now. It's hard to break us. As a matter of fact, you ain't gonna do it.

[00:00:48] Lend an ear.

[00:00:49] These are some of the best questions I've had, I have to tell you that straight up.

[00:00:52] As the Church Pew Sports Podcast begins.

[00:00:55] The only matter is about us. Not the lights, not the cameras, not the action. It's about the action.

[00:01:01] I don't get it.

[00:01:02] Give each other high five!

[00:01:07] And with that we welcome you into another episode of the Church Pew Sports Podcast, connecting faith to sports and life.

[00:01:13] And we're so glad to have you all with us. This is a potentially very special week for a number of reasons.

[00:01:20] Paul Miller and I get together during Michigan Ohio State Week.

[00:01:25] So you never really know what kind of fireworks may erupt from all of that, because I, of course, would represent the maize in blue.

[00:01:32] And Paul is literally, if you're watching the video version of this podcast today, he's wearing, just to taunt and to troll a bit, he's wearing his Ohio State quarter zip.

[00:01:41] So, Paul, I don't know if that's a 15 yard penalty or how you'd like to be flagged for that, but it's definitely an infraction.

[00:01:49] Well, as my son would say, it ain't bragging if you back it up.

[00:01:55] We've won three in a row. Come on!

[00:01:57] I'm just going to go out there right now and say that I'm feeling pretty good about it next weekend.

[00:02:03] Well, we'll talk about that in the moments ahead, but for the last, honestly, for probably over a year now, we have been trying to connect with our special guest today.

[00:02:13] So thankful for the entire team at Focus on the Family who has helped kind of set all this in motion, including, I believe, a timely injury and surgery to our guests so that he couldn't go anywhere.

[00:02:26] He literally couldn't escape as we are joined by the president to Focus on the Family, big football guy, big golf guy, Jim Daly. How are you, sir?

[00:02:36] Hey, Bill. I'm doing great. Paul, I agree with you. I think Ohio's got this one. Ohio State all the way on that one. Sorry, Bill.

[00:02:43] No, it's okay. We're still living off of the glory. I don't even care how this one comes out, but wouldn't it be sweet if somehow...

[00:02:51] It'd be a good upset.

[00:02:52] Yes. Those are the best kinds. We like those.

[00:02:56] Paul, why don't you bring Jim into the podcast like we do all of our first-time guests, and then we'll start digging into his passion a bit.

[00:03:05] Okay, yeah. Jim, welcome. It's really great to have you here. We have a little hazing tradition that we do with all first-time guests on the podcast.

[00:03:12] It's really just a question to give our listeners a chance to get to know you a little bit.

[00:03:17] And the question is this. What are your irrational sports loyalties?

[00:03:24] What are your irrational sports loyalties?

[00:03:25] Like those teams that you follow, any sport, any level that you follow at levels where other sports fans and maybe your wife goes, hey, you need to relax a little bit.

[00:03:36] So what are your irrational sports loyalties?

[00:03:39] Oh, totally. So I grew up in Southern Cal, but when I was five years old, I just loved the Broncos.

[00:03:45] I thought that's how you should play football in the snow, the wet, the cold.

[00:03:49] It just, I was in awe of it my entire life.

[00:03:52] And then we finally moved to Colorado.

[00:03:54] I could actually become a true Bronco fan.

[00:03:57] So my irrational support of the Broncos, particularly over the last 10 years where we've done absolutely nothing.

[00:04:03] We've been in this rebuilding phase for the last decade.

[00:04:07] And that's been my irrationality, but we're looking pretty good now.

[00:04:11] So we're coming back, hopefully a playoff berth this year with Bo Nix.

[00:04:15] And yeah, I'm excited.

[00:04:17] So my irrationality might be coming around to some truth.

[00:04:22] When I picture in my mind, the irrational level of fandom in Bronco country,

[00:04:27] I'm of course, picturing the guy that used to just wear the barrel around him.

[00:04:32] We painted his upper body orange and then he just wore the barrel everywhere.

[00:04:35] So I guess I never looked closely enough at his face.

[00:04:39] Jim, would you like to confirm or deny for the record that you were Bronco guy in the barrel?

[00:04:46] You know, I think I am coming to the age where I could be that guy.

[00:04:50] I think his name was Fred, but you know, I saw some games.

[00:04:54] It was like zero and Fred was out there in his barrel with his chest hair showing for the nation.

[00:04:59] But I don't think my wife would really appreciate me being in a barrel and only a barrel.

[00:05:05] She would advise me that that would be unwise.

[00:05:08] Well, listen, I don't, I don't serve on the board at Focus on the Family,

[00:05:12] but I'm going to go out on a limb and just probably predict that they might also have a special conversation with their president.

[00:05:19] If you turned up on Fox.

[00:05:21] It might be the length of the barrel.

[00:05:22] If the barrel's long enough down to my knees, it might be okay.

[00:05:26] It might be all right.

[00:05:27] Okay. So what's, what's your threshold for tolerance in sitting in the seats in the stadium,

[00:05:34] weather wise, temperature wise, what will you put up with?

[00:05:37] Yeah. Terrible. I had my brother-in-law was Al Davis is a right hand guy.

[00:05:42] He was head of the scouts for the Raiders.

[00:05:44] So every time once a year, of course, AFC West, we'd be, we'd have the Raiders here at the mile high stadium.

[00:05:52] And so my brother-in-law would give us tickets and the, first of all, but the,

[00:05:56] I think the home team gives the visiting team, the tickets, they would stick us way up on the top rim of the stadium.

[00:06:03] And these were, I was sitting with all of the Raider fans, like the family members of the Raiders.

[00:06:10] And I'm a Bronco fan.

[00:06:11] And I would only tell you, I saw so many middle fingers being flipped at me from the Bronco fans.

[00:06:16] And they're thinking I'm a Raiders fan.

[00:06:19] And I'm going, no, I'm with you.

[00:06:20] But, but John, my brother-in-law said I couldn't wear Bronco colors in that section.

[00:06:26] So, and it was cold.

[00:06:27] It was really cold.

[00:06:28] I, one night we had sleet.

[00:06:30] It was a Monday night game.

[00:06:31] It was chilly.

[00:06:32] It was like snowing.

[00:06:33] And we're literally like on the third row from the top at mile high.

[00:06:38] And it was cold.

[00:06:40] Did you stay all four quarters?

[00:06:41] Do I have to tell you?

[00:06:44] No, we were out of there, I think just about at halftime.

[00:06:48] Yeah.

[00:06:48] Paul, what's your threshold, Paul?

[00:06:51] You're a Bears guy.

[00:06:52] So, I mean, you've got to answer that question as well.

[00:06:55] I'm kind of a diehard stay to the end when we're at Soldier Field, but it's been a long time since I've been to a Bears game, which is kind of, I'm waiting, waiting for a reason.

[00:07:07] I'm waiting for a reason to brave the elements and get out in support of them again.

[00:07:12] But Jim, here's my question for you.

[00:07:14] I'm curious about how far back you're, you said all the way back to when you're five years old, right?

[00:07:18] So what's your, what's your earliest, like legit, I was at a game Bronco fan memory.

[00:07:26] And I guess we should probably say thank you for, was it, was it 98 when you guys beat the Packers in the Super Bowl?

[00:07:34] So on behalf of the Bears fan and Bill, the Lions fan, I want to thank you for that off the top.

[00:07:39] Yeah, I mean, my earliest memories of that, I go, I would go all the way back.

[00:07:45] I think, I can't even think, it was the Orange Crush, you know, it was that studly defensive line.

[00:07:50] And then I think the quarterback even back, was it Morton?

[00:07:53] Yeah, Greg Morton.

[00:07:54] Greg Morton.

[00:07:55] But way before Elway, actually.

[00:07:57] But I think, yeah, I just loved it.

[00:07:59] Now you guys with the Bears, you've been in a rebuilding since what, 80, 89?

[00:08:05] Yeah, there's, I did the research once.

[00:08:07] It was something like 27 different quarterbacks since the Bears, like in this last 10 years or whatever.

[00:08:13] So, yeah, the Bears have been...

[00:08:15] We know that feeling.

[00:08:17] Yeah, until they make a change at the top of the organization, I don't believe they're ever going to solve.

[00:08:23] Paul, they just brought in the former Big Ten commissioner to run the team.

[00:08:27] And what a fantastic job he did at the Big Ten.

[00:08:30] He's just giving so much confidence to us Big Ten guys.

[00:08:36] You guys are good.

[00:08:37] I like this.

[00:08:38] Where's the praying part for our teams?

[00:08:40] Is that coming at some point?

[00:08:40] It's coming because I'm a Lions guy.

[00:08:42] So, you didn't know this coming in, Jim, but first of all, I'm Lions and Michigan, and Paul is Bears in Ohio State.

[00:08:50] So, we've got differing trends for our teams right now.

[00:08:54] In fact, I would love to get the thoughts of somebody who isn't connected or, you know, emotionally invested in like the Lions.

[00:09:02] I'd love to know your thoughts as an organizational leader about a guy like Dan Campbell, who has certainly brought about the highest levels of buy-in from this team.

[00:09:17] Let me play for you a quick soundbite of Dan after they beat the Colts Sunday afternoon.

[00:09:21] That's a good job.

[00:09:22] That got us to ten.

[00:09:23] That's ten.

[00:09:24] That's nine in a row.

[00:09:25] How many of you guys have won nine in a row in here in the NFL?

[00:09:28] Raise your hand.

[00:09:28] I'm saying something.

[00:09:29] It's rare.

[00:09:30] All right?

[00:09:30] We're in rare air right now.

[00:09:31] All right?

[00:09:31] So, we're doing something special, which we knew we would.

[00:09:34] The thing is about road games.

[00:09:35] Road games.

[00:09:36] We were all 11-1.

[00:09:38] All 11-1 on the road.

[00:09:40] 21, half of 22.

[00:09:41] And then we went to Chicago and got it.

[00:09:43] We got our first dub, and since then we're 16-5 on the road, man.

[00:09:47] And every one of you are a part of that.

[00:09:49] Every one of you are a part of that.

[00:09:50] That's big, man.

[00:09:50] 16-5 on the road.

[00:09:52] All right?

[00:09:52] So, we're road warriors.

[00:09:54] We are road warriors.

[00:09:55] I'm curious what the perception of Campbell is from afar.

[00:10:01] Oh, no.

[00:10:02] I think, you know, I'm looking at Detroit.

[00:10:04] Thankfully, they're NFC.

[00:10:05] We're AFC with the Broncos.

[00:10:07] But I admire them.

[00:10:08] I was actually last year at the game where Russell Wilson got chewed out by Sean Payton

[00:10:14] on the sideline.

[00:10:15] We were like six rows up from the Denver bench, and we could hear him yelling.

[00:10:20] Sean Payton.

[00:10:21] And we were thinking, and we got shellacked by the Lions.

[00:10:24] And I thought, man, this team, if they don't do it this year, I think they're going to do it next year.

[00:10:29] So, I just think the Lions have all the ingredients to do it right.

[00:10:33] That's a great speech by the coach.

[00:10:36] Casting vision.

[00:10:37] You haven't been here before.

[00:10:38] This is rarefied air.

[00:10:40] Don't you love that?

[00:10:41] It's kind of like Jesus saying, hey, okay, I'm the kingdom that's coming.

[00:10:45] And so you want to play on my team.

[00:10:47] I love it.

[00:10:48] I think he's got all the right stuff.

[00:10:50] And I think the team's doing great.

[00:10:52] A board member of mine lives in just outside Michigan.

[00:10:55] And so he goes to most of the games just outside of Detroit, I should say.

[00:10:59] So he goes to most of the games and gives me a roundup, kind of a newsletter every Sunday after the Lions win.

[00:11:07] Well, I know there are all sorts of effective leadership styles.

[00:11:12] But I, and Paul, you can correct me if I'm wrong.

[00:11:15] I don't think I would, we will ever see the day where Dan Campbell publicly chews out a player on the sidelines.

[00:11:24] Like Jim just described of Sean Payton and two-time Super Bowl champion Russell Wilson,

[00:11:30] who if I remember right about that game, wasn't playing all that horribly.

[00:11:34] The defense of the Broncos was terrible that day.

[00:11:38] So, different leadership styles.

[00:11:40] But what do we make of the Sean Payton approach?

[00:11:43] Now from afar, I'm not a big Sean Payton fan.

[00:11:48] You're just going to go right forward.

[00:11:50] Yeah, I would tend to go.

[00:11:51] I thought, oh, go ahead.

[00:11:52] Sorry, go ahead.

[00:11:53] No, I was just, I was, I'm curious to get your take on Sean Payton.

[00:11:57] He finds his way into the headlines on occasion.

[00:12:00] We'll just say that.

[00:12:03] Yeah.

[00:12:04] And I think, you know, I was a little shocked when I sat at that Detroit game in the stands,

[00:12:08] listening to that back and forth in the presser afterwards.

[00:12:12] And we couldn't figure out what was going on, how it was his fault that the running back didn't get over the line

[00:12:18] or didn't get over the goal line sufficiently, I guess.

[00:12:22] But there must've been a lot going on behind the scenes that none of us knew about.

[00:12:26] I don't think Russell Wilson was Sean Payton's guy from the get go.

[00:12:31] Uh, that seemed to be pretty clear.

[00:12:33] I love the way Bo Nix and Sean Payton are relating to each other.

[00:12:37] You know, they had a little tassel on a little tussle on the sideline a couple of weeks ago.

[00:12:41] And Bo Nix is a response when he was asked, what were you saying to the coach?

[00:12:45] And he said, I was telling him how much I love him.

[00:12:49] So I like Bo Nix's approach is Christian approach.

[00:12:52] He's a believer.

[00:12:53] I'm actually trying to get them on the program here to focus on the family.

[00:12:56] But, uh, you know, coaches, there's all kinds of coaches that believe they motivate their players in the right way.

[00:13:02] Sean Payton probably has a little more hard liner approach.

[00:13:06] He's trying to figure out if I speak down to this guy, will that help him play up?

[00:13:12] And, uh, you know, as a Christian, that's not my approach.

[00:13:16] I would try something a little different, but, uh, you know, that's what they're paid for.

[00:13:20] And the results end up being the, the end game for him.

[00:13:23] So if they're winning, they're going to get pats on the back for coaching that way.

[00:13:26] And if they're losing, they'll probably get replaced.

[00:13:29] I cannot, I cannot imagine by the way, the stories your brother-in-law must have from the Al Davis days.

[00:13:37] He's got some good ones.

[00:13:38] They ate dinner every night together.

[00:13:40] The funniest story is when he was telling Al Davis that he was going to marry my wife's sister, Mimi.

[00:13:47] And Al Davis cried in the car saying, who am I going to have dinner with?

[00:13:52] Seriously.

[00:13:53] I was like, bro, man, football means a little too much to you.

[00:13:55] If you can't, uh, you know, congratulate a guy who's getting married.

[00:13:58] So, but, uh, yeah, he was sold out.

[00:14:01] He loved the Raiders.

[00:14:02] He loved the experience.

[00:14:03] He worked there 35 years with Al Davis before Al died.

[00:14:07] Great stories, fun stories.

[00:14:10] And, uh, he's got a book out actually behind the silver, behind the silver and black curtain, something like that written with the sports illustrated guys.

[00:14:19] So all the stories are in there and all the language of the story.

[00:14:23] So it's not a Christian book.

[00:14:25] Yeah.

[00:14:26] So Jim, my question, I'm always curious whenever we have a passion from somewhere other than like the Midwest river, I'm always curious who, who are the athletes like in the Denver sports market that, um, seem to have an authentic faith, you know, guys that might be connected to folks on the family or whatever.

[00:14:47] You mentioned Bo Nix.

[00:14:48] Is there anybody else?

[00:14:49] Cause I think our listeners are always interested in knowing who are the people that are maybe outside my viewing area.

[00:14:55] That's a, yeah, that's a good question.

[00:14:57] And, you know, being national, our ministry is more of an international national ministry.

[00:15:01] So, you know, Bo Nix is somebody that I'm aware of on the, on the Broncos.

[00:15:06] Of course, Peyton Manning was there and Peyton is more of a Catholic tradition.

[00:15:11] He and his family, Archie.

[00:15:12] And so they were people that we were always trying to connect with.

[00:15:16] I met him a couple of times at Augusta when I played golf there.

[00:15:19] It was, Oh, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[00:15:21] I'm sorry.

[00:15:22] This is really funny.

[00:15:23] This is so funny.

[00:15:24] So I'm coming up the ninth hole.

[00:15:26] Drop that out of nowhere.

[00:15:27] And he's coming up the 18th hole.

[00:15:30] And, and my friend who's the member, I said, he said, you know, you can go over and say hi.

[00:15:34] I didn't want to impose on his.

[00:15:36] I think he was playing with Eli and a couple other guys.

[00:15:38] So we're, we're up at the drink cart at the same time.

[00:15:41] So I just said to Peyton, Hey, I'm from Colorado.

[00:15:43] And thanks for the super bowls.

[00:15:45] And how are you playing today?

[00:15:46] And Peyton, Peyton style, he goes, well, my drive, I hit it just short of the sand trap.

[00:15:51] And then I took out a, you know, I took out a six iron trying to hit it to the green, but then I hit it right right of the green into that other sand trap, took a lob wedge.

[00:15:59] I was able to get it three feet in the pen.

[00:16:00] I still got my par.

[00:16:02] Like only Peyton would describe his golf day like that, like down to every swing on this hole.

[00:16:08] He's intense, man.

[00:16:09] That guy's awesome.

[00:16:10] We just have to bring up the program to a brief stop here for just a quick football related time.

[00:16:16] Uh, time we're gonna take a two minute time out because Jim just casually dropped in that he was playing at Augusta national, which of course, most of us in the golf world would crawl from Michigan to Augusta on broken glass for the opportunity to play.

[00:16:31] Which I guess just leads me to a innocent, uh, very selfless question is when do I get to go with you?

[00:16:43] So did I just open that door?

[00:16:45] Awkward pause.

[00:16:46] Did I say Augusta national?

[00:16:48] I meant Augusta country club right next door.

[00:16:49] I'll take it.

[00:16:51] I'll take it.

[00:16:51] I'll take it.

[00:16:52] Um, you know, I, I love these, these conversations and I know Paul does as well about leadership in general.

[00:16:58] We've talked about a couple of coaches and bringing teams together.

[00:17:02] There there's also that discussion.

[00:17:04] One could have even maybe even with Denver in mind where you go from decades of Dan Reeves leading you to Super Bowls and anybody who comes behind has some, some tough shoes to fill.

[00:17:15] Right?

[00:17:16] I mean, that's just, that's the nature of the beast at any level in sports, but also in ministry.

[00:17:22] Right?

[00:17:22] So how did you kind of take some of the lessons that you have gleaned from great coaches in your past or just coaches that you admire to kind of bring that into your leadership at focus on the family, which I listened to the podcast of your full story.

[00:17:39] And that was not the dream you had since being a little boy.

[00:17:42] This was not the, uh, the thing that you saw the Lord scripting out for you.

[00:17:46] So how did you bring kind of all that together to lead an international ministry team?

[00:17:53] Well, I think in my case, and I would apply this to all of us.

[00:17:58] I don't think the Lord wastes a moment when we're children, when we're teenagers to shape what he wants in us as adults, et cetera.

[00:18:06] So I think for me, just never experiencing a normal family was what he had in mind for the role.

[00:18:13] And I, I remember coming into this, you know, I'd worked here, my wife, Jean, and I said, let's give this like a two year mission commitment.

[00:18:21] And then we'll leave and go back into business and buy our house and get our family going, et cetera.

[00:18:27] So that, that was, I look back on that.

[00:18:29] I think how arrogant that is to wheel and deal with the Lord that way, Lord, I'll give you two years of my valuable life.

[00:18:36] And then I'm going back into making money.

[00:18:38] Uh, you know, it's silly that I would have thought that way at 25, 26, but that was kind of what I was thinking.

[00:18:45] And then to be here now 35 years and to be walking down that hall with Don Hodel, who was Reagan's secretary of energy and interior.

[00:18:53] He came to work here at focus to help Dr.

[00:18:55] Dobson for probably about 20 months to kind of get his hands off the wheel for the next guy.

[00:19:02] And then Don and Dr.

[00:19:03] Dobson saying to me, we think you're the next guy.

[00:19:06] I was like, I don't want to be the next guy.

[00:19:08] I don't, I'm not perfect.

[00:19:10] I, you know, I'm coming from a broken family.

[00:19:12] I had a normal dysfunctional family.

[00:19:15] I lived with a single parent mom.

[00:19:18] My dad had divorced my mom and, and, uh, you know, then I lived, my mom passed away.

[00:19:23] She remarried a year and a half before she passed away.

[00:19:26] Hank the tank.

[00:19:27] I called him my stepdad.

[00:19:29] Then she died a year and a half later.

[00:19:30] I went into foster care.

[00:19:32] My bio dad got back into my life.

[00:19:34] I lived with him for a year and then I decided not to live with him anymore.

[00:19:38] I lived with my brother who just married his 16 year old pregnant girlfriend.

[00:19:42] My dad then died about four months after that.

[00:19:46] And, uh, you know, I was just turbulence the whole way.

[00:19:50] And yet at the same time, when I was thinking about this opportunity at focus, it's like the

[00:19:56] Lord just said, I, I own it all.

[00:19:59] I own the broken pieces.

[00:20:01] I own the good pieces like what Dr.

[00:20:03] Dobson came from.

[00:20:05] And so that really settled in my heart, you know, that God,

[00:20:08] in many ways had crafted me, I think.

[00:20:12] And looking back, especially in a hyper critical culture.

[00:20:16] Uh, but I've literally had just about every family type you could have lived in as a kid.

[00:20:21] And, uh, it kind of prepared me in a unique way.

[00:20:24] So, you know, the, the doubts, the fears, those things that coaches will coach you up.

[00:20:30] Uh, when I played quarterback in high school, I had plenty of doubts and fears and I so appreciated

[00:20:36] so many coaches saying, no, you've got this, you've got the talent.

[00:20:39] You just have to believe and, uh, being able to kind of run the team and do the things I needed to do in that role.

[00:20:46] But I, I think, you know, most of all, it's the importance of being who God has called you to be.

[00:20:52] I remember the first press conference we had the day of transition, Dr.

[00:20:56] Dobson and I standing there and a, uh, a journalist from the AP asked me the question,

[00:21:02] how are you going to fill his shoes?

[00:21:04] And I quickly thought, well, I can't, I got to get my own pair of shoes.

[00:21:08] And I think that's your point.

[00:21:10] I mean, I, you can't live another person's life.

[00:21:12] You can't lead like that person.

[00:21:14] You got to lead the way that God has crafted you to lead.

[00:21:17] And that's what I've tried to do.

[00:21:19] And that's true of each one of us.

[00:21:21] When we get these positions that God can use for influence, he's made us in a unique way to do it,

[00:21:28] a unique way that has our fingerprint and our, our stripes and, uh, pain attached to it.

[00:21:36] So praise God, he brought me through it all.

[00:21:39] And here we go.

[00:21:40] Well, that's awesome.

[00:21:41] I, um, there's a lot of pastors that listen to this podcast, right?

[00:21:47] That, um, can often, I think, feel like they're the ground under their ministry feet is a little unstable,

[00:21:53] you know, and all that.

[00:21:54] So Jim, I'm wondering what, um, disciplines or spiritual practices that you have that you would recommend

[00:22:03] to pastors for those to, to kind of, um, guard yourself for those seasons where things can be turbulent.

[00:22:09] Yeah, Paul.

[00:22:09] I mean, that, that is such a good, deep, critical question.

[00:22:13] I, I, and you know, it probably looks different from different angles for me with focus on the family,

[00:22:18] when I'm talking to pastors and I'm not a pastor.

[00:22:22] Yeah.

[00:22:22] I have an MBA and came into focus.

[00:22:25] My brother is a pastor though, and I've seen his life and some of the difficulties he's gone through leading churches,

[00:22:32] et cetera.

[00:22:33] But probably the main thing, and I've kind of come to this realization a bit late, uh, COVID really helped my wife and I to slow down and spend more time together in the morning,

[00:22:45] praying together, reading the word together.

[00:22:48] You know, when you look at that and I think in ministry, whether it's church or parachurch, we tend to, yeah,

[00:22:53] we're surrounded by the word.

[00:22:55] We're surrounded by believers.

[00:22:56] We're working on it.

[00:22:57] We're helping save marriages.

[00:22:59] We're helping to save a life, whether through saving a woman from making a choice for abortion

[00:23:05] to a suicidal call that we'll get on our counseling lines, all those good things.

[00:23:09] The point being we're immersed in it all day.

[00:23:12] And so you go home and you're going, you know, Gene would say, we need a devotional for the kids tonight.

[00:23:17] I'm going, man, I am spent, you know, it's such a cop out.

[00:23:21] So in that, what I'm saying is those basic disciplines of reading with your spouse, praying with your spouse, reducing that divorce rate,

[00:23:31] because couples that do that, I think the divorce rate is under 5%, if I remember correctly.

[00:23:37] So for pastors, particularly one of the things that breaks my heart for us being in leadership within the church is being able to model what it means to have a good,

[00:23:49] not perfect, a good, healthy relationship with our spouses, with our kids, the expectations.

[00:23:56] I've tried with my two boys, Trent and Troy, to give them a normal life.

[00:24:01] And what I meant by that was not the kind of the man out there in public, act right.

[00:24:07] You're my kid.

[00:24:08] You got to behave perfectly.

[00:24:10] We kind of jettison that, which I give my wife a great deal of credit for just to be normal and not have these bizarre, weird expectations that our kids would perform for people here at Focus or the donor community, whatever it might be.

[00:24:25] So when I'm looking at that, that's what I'm thinking of for pastors particularly.

[00:24:29] Ask the church for the ability to raise your kids as your pastor.

[00:24:35] That means they're going to be normal kids.

[00:24:37] Please don't treat them differently.

[00:24:38] When it comes to my wife and I, we're not perfect people.

[00:24:42] And if you can create that atmosphere, it actually reflects the way they should be.

[00:24:47] Your congregants should be behaving as well.

[00:24:50] I think that's a healthy place to be.

[00:24:52] Let's not expect perfection, but let's expect brokenness that's healed by God and moving forward.

[00:24:58] I love a good friend of mine, John Burke, who wrote Imagine God.

[00:25:02] He collected and interviewed all these near-death experience people.

[00:25:06] But his slogan at his church is, all are welcome, but you can't remain there.

[00:25:12] Which is a great slogan.

[00:25:14] Like, come in.

[00:25:15] Everybody's welcome with all your brokenness.

[00:25:17] But you can't stay in that place.

[00:25:19] You've got to continue to grow in Christ.

[00:25:22] I think that's beautiful.

[00:25:23] And in many ways, that's our prayer for those who listen to this podcast.

[00:25:27] The vast majority of our audience, men, we do have some very kind ladies who listen to the podcast,

[00:25:35] and we'll send a note every once in a while.

[00:25:37] And my wife is a faithful listener, and she has a choice.

[00:25:40] It's okay.

[00:25:40] It's okay.

[00:25:41] But for the men who listen to this, you know, Paul and I have both talked over the last few years about why we do this.

[00:25:51] And the why we do this, in some cases, is to encourage other guests, hosts who will come on with us.

[00:25:59] We have guys who come on who have a difficult life story.

[00:26:03] And then the other side of that is we really want to remind men that there is more to life than the toy box of life,

[00:26:11] which is, of course, the sports world.

[00:26:12] We do.

[00:26:13] We get very passionate about all of it.

[00:26:15] But we are in a culture, in an era of isolation, especially, I think, among men.

[00:26:22] I think relational development has become really poor, and we've poured more of ourselves into our devices

[00:26:29] and maybe into our favorite teams than we have into relationship building.

[00:26:33] You study this.

[00:26:34] Your team does all of this all the time.

[00:26:38] Have you noticed an epidemic isolation among men?

[00:26:42] And how can, I don't know, how can even a podcast like this help to heal that?

[00:26:49] No, I mean, I think when you look at politics and sports, they kind of carry the weight in the culture,

[00:26:54] which is, I guess, understandable because they're energized by those themes,

[00:27:00] certainly on the sports side for all of us.

[00:27:03] My wife occasionally say, it seems like you're more into sports than maybe the gospel.

[00:27:09] Now, that's a good hit, right?

[00:27:11] And I think as a Christian man, I've got to remember that.

[00:27:14] I take that criticism correctly, constructively,

[00:27:18] because I should first and foremost be looking for those opportunities to let my faith shine in that environment

[00:27:24] and have a good time.

[00:27:26] I love playing golf with guys, and they'll say this is, you know,

[00:27:30] I didn't know what to expect playing golf with you, but it was one of the funnest times I've had

[00:27:35] because we can't, we're not being paid for this stuff, you know?

[00:27:38] Right.

[00:27:39] If I miss a shot, I miss a shot.

[00:27:41] It's not a big deal.

[00:27:41] It's not the end of my life.

[00:27:43] But like you, Bill, and maybe Paul, if you're playing golf, you've played with people that,

[00:27:48] I mean, they miss a shot.

[00:27:50] It's like the end of the world for them.

[00:27:51] Their whole value of their lives rests on making that shot.

[00:27:56] And it's ridiculous.

[00:27:57] So in all that, I think podcasts, the isolation issue,

[00:28:02] we're more lonely today than we've ever been, even though we're more connected than we've ever been.

[00:28:07] And I think men are loners by nature.

[00:28:10] I think God, to some degree, has created us in that respect to be able to do the things that we need to do.

[00:28:15] But I think it's godly to get into relationship, be in relationship.

[00:28:21] Where men and relationship are happening, households are more shalom, more peaceful.

[00:28:29] Communities are more peaceful.

[00:28:31] I was just talking to Pastor Brady Boyd from New Life.

[00:28:34] We taped with him this morning.

[00:28:35] And he was telling me a story about Chicago, where all the burning and looting had broken out.

[00:28:42] And about 500 Christian men got together and came out to the community and told them, no, no more.

[00:28:50] We're here to settle this down.

[00:28:52] This is not the proper behavior.

[00:28:54] And I thought, wow, that's not toxic masculinity.

[00:28:59] That's healthy, godly masculinity, where they're bringing their power to bear on something that's out of place, out of order.

[00:29:08] Chaos, which is another word for sin.

[00:29:11] So that's awesome.

[00:29:13] I think anywhere guys, particularly Christian guys, could get around anything.

[00:29:17] I mean, we love sports.

[00:29:18] Let's use that as the catalyst like you're doing for the podcast.

[00:29:21] But then how do we drive that to meaningful engagement in the community around us?

[00:29:27] Paul, should we risk losing Jim when I share with him your attitude regarding golf?

[00:29:36] I'll just mute my mic.

[00:29:40] Believe it or not, Jim, first of all, thank you for that really thoughtful answer.

[00:29:45] Don't let my smart aleck follow up diminish from what you've just shared.

[00:29:49] Paul kind of looks like a football player.

[00:29:51] Yeah, Paul has actually uttered the thought aloud on this podcast that golf's not a sport.

[00:29:57] And that's one of the reasons that we've moved him a few states away.

[00:30:01] He had to go.

[00:30:02] He could not stay.

[00:30:04] It's just a very skilled activity.

[00:30:06] We've talked about that on this show, Bill.

[00:30:08] And I think you guys put me in my place, if I remember right.

[00:30:10] We're still trying.

[00:30:13] Jim, one of the things we do have here at Church Pew Sports is an elaborate and well-financed research team.

[00:30:21] In fact, it's sitting next to you.

[00:30:22] I think his name is Kirk.

[00:30:24] And he kind of cued me in to your athletic history a bit.

[00:30:31] And that back in high school as a quarterback, some pretty powerful moments occurred.

[00:30:36] So take us back to Jim Daly, high school senior quarterback.

[00:30:42] And bring us into the stadium.

[00:30:44] Bring us into the moments here.

[00:30:47] No, no, it was fun.

[00:30:48] I had a coach, Don Bandy, who played for Vince Lombardi.

[00:30:51] He actually played for Lombardi with the Washington Redskins.

[00:30:55] And he was the left tackle, if I remember correctly, or right tackle.

[00:30:59] And he didn't really like running the ball.

[00:31:02] He loved throwing the ball.

[00:31:03] We were throwing the ball 40 to 50 times a game in high school.

[00:31:07] I was getting 400, 500 yards of passing every game.

[00:31:11] So I mean, I was getting letters from around the country.

[00:31:14] You know, we consider our school TCU, UNLV.

[00:31:17] And this would have been 1980.

[00:31:19] And so anyway, I was getting pretty cocky with my ability.

[00:31:25] And my brother who played at Nevada, Reno, he was a defensive tackle.

[00:31:30] He was 6'5", 6'6", 300 pounds.

[00:31:33] And I remember one day he said to me, you're getting too much of an ego.

[00:31:37] And he had become a Christian.

[00:31:38] I was a wobbly Christian, I would say.

[00:31:41] I had made a commitment to the Lord when I was 15 through fellowship of Christian athletes.

[00:31:46] But I was still, you know, going out Friday night after the game and kissing girls

[00:31:49] and all the stuff I needed to kind of get under control.

[00:31:53] And I just remember these schools, I thought, okay, I'll go play D1 ball.

[00:31:57] But maybe I shouldn't because it'll take me away from God.

[00:32:00] And I remember we're playing Big Bear, California.

[00:32:03] I prayed.

[00:32:03] It was a Saturday game, which was odd.

[00:32:05] Saturday day game.

[00:32:06] And I knelt down with Danny Paul, my tight end.

[00:32:09] And we prayed.

[00:32:10] I think we were the only two marginal Christians on the team.

[00:32:12] And I just remember praying, Lord, if you don't want me to play college ball

[00:32:16] because it'll take me away from you, break a bone today, but don't let it hurt.

[00:32:19] And Danny goes, what a quarterback prayer.

[00:32:22] I mean, what a wussy.

[00:32:24] And so anyway, so bizarrely, the third quarter of this game, we had twins that played tailback

[00:32:33] and fullback.

[00:32:34] And the fullback came up from the bottom of the pile, took a swing at a guy because the

[00:32:40] guy was punching him in the pile.

[00:32:42] And so he gets ejected.

[00:32:44] Parrish Robbins, not that I'll ever forget Parrish, the sophomore comes into the game,

[00:32:50] straight drop back pass.

[00:32:51] I called, I'm going to throw an out on second down 10 yards to go.

[00:32:55] It was second and 10.

[00:32:56] Of course, Don Bandy's calling a pass play and it's an out on the left side.

[00:33:00] And he, we break the huddle and Parrish looks at me as the new fullback and says, what do I do?

[00:33:05] I got crud.

[00:33:06] I got crud.

[00:33:06] And I said, well, step to my right and hit somebody inside out.

[00:33:10] Okay.

[00:33:11] And I remember we played the game film over and over because this guy, I dropped back,

[00:33:17] I go to throw the ball and Parrish, this outside linebacker is blitzing.

[00:33:21] And Parrish doesn't chip block him, doesn't touch him, jumps out of the guy's way.

[00:33:26] The guy goes under Parrish's arm and I'm throwing the ball and he hits me right in the armpit.

[00:33:32] We, both of us are off the ground in the game film.

[00:33:36] We're flying through the air because he had a dead run for me.

[00:33:40] And then I landed and I got up, I'm in the huddle.

[00:33:43] I reach under my shoulder pads and I could feel my collarbone is snapped in half.

[00:33:48] And I go, you guys, God has answered my prayer.

[00:33:51] And they thought I had a concussion.

[00:33:52] So they're like, timeout, timeout.

[00:33:54] And I just walked out the field and that was it.

[00:33:57] I mean, I went to the hospital, they put me in a brace and I thought, okay, Lord, that didn't really hurt.

[00:34:02] Thank you.

[00:34:03] And I got your message.

[00:34:04] So some might say, yeah, really?

[00:34:06] But you know what?

[00:34:07] I was pretty specific.

[00:34:08] Break a bone today, but don't let it hurt.

[00:34:11] And I do think if I would have gone to play for TCU or UNLV, I think that environment would have been so distracting with playing sports, girls, the whole bit.

[00:34:22] I think I could have easily begun to go down a path that took me away from the Lord, maybe for the rest of my life.

[00:34:29] Yeah.

[00:34:29] I'm sure there are very dedicated believers who attend UNLV, but man, in the early eighties in Vegas.

[00:34:39] Yeah.

[00:34:40] Yeah.

[00:34:41] It's arcanean.

[00:34:42] The year before it was, oh, who went on to play with Philadelphia?

[00:34:46] The fast quarterback, Randall, Randall Cunningham.

[00:34:50] He played out of UNLV.

[00:34:52] So that would have been my competition.

[00:34:53] I said he'd been faster, but I could have thrown the ball farther.

[00:34:58] That's wild.

[00:35:00] That's how cocky I was.

[00:35:01] I could throw 70 yards in high school.

[00:35:03] So the moral of your story, Jim, is careful what you pray for.

[00:35:08] Right?

[00:35:09] Yeah.

[00:35:09] I think that's part of it.

[00:35:11] I think the Lord must have gone, hey, Michael, Gabriel, check this prayer out.

[00:35:15] Watch this.

[00:35:15] Watch how this goes.

[00:35:17] Okay.

[00:35:18] So then my follow-up question would be, you have this great ministry that you're leading,

[00:35:24] and I'm sure that Jesus has given you opportunities all the time for influence and all that kind

[00:35:29] of stuff.

[00:35:29] How can our audience pray for you most effectively?

[00:35:36] Because we will pray.

[00:35:38] We will pray.

[00:35:39] No, I appreciate that.

[00:35:40] I think for us here at Focus, it's, you know, David had it right and Solomon had it right.

[00:35:48] You know, praying for wisdom is outstanding.

[00:35:50] I think wisdom is what we need today.

[00:35:54] And I think that protection in our own private lives that we truly are who we are, both out

[00:35:59] here in public as we are in private, that too many Christian leaders are going down.

[00:36:04] Pastors are going down and we've got to find that way to be accountable, humble.

[00:36:09] I mean, right now it's if I could go through this leadership at Focus and retire, not having

[00:36:16] an affair, I'm going to get a data boy.

[00:36:18] What a low bar that is.

[00:36:19] Yeah.

[00:36:20] That should be a given that we can get through without those messes.

[00:36:23] And I know those things happen.

[00:36:26] But wouldn't it be good if the body of Christ were healthier in that way?

[00:36:30] Okay.

[00:36:31] So, I mean, prayer for wisdom, for protection in that regard, for humility.

[00:36:35] You've got that combo of wisdom and humility.

[00:36:37] I think the Lord will use you.

[00:36:39] And, you know, for the impact that we have, we're trying to save as many marriages as we

[00:36:44] can.

[00:36:44] We have hope restored, 80% success rate post two years later.

[00:36:49] Any of the pastors who need help in their marriage, don't hide, don't wait until it's

[00:36:54] broken.

[00:36:55] Give us a call of focus.

[00:36:56] We have scholarships for pastors, particularly to help you and your marriage do much better.

[00:37:03] And we're willing to invest in you in that way.

[00:37:06] So, yeah.

[00:37:07] Yeah, I love that.

[00:37:08] Jim, every week on this podcast, we have a few different segments that we do to have

[00:37:12] a little fun with.

[00:37:13] One of them is going to give you a chance to vent about anything that's troubling or irritating

[00:37:19] you from the world of sports.

[00:37:20] It's called Holy Discontent.

[00:37:24] You know, it's amazing.

[00:37:25] I saw that when I was reading on kind of what you're trying to do.

[00:37:28] Blow off some steam.

[00:37:29] Get it off your chest.

[00:37:31] Rant about what's most bothering you.

[00:37:33] I got a lot of problems with you people.

[00:37:35] Now you're going to hear about it.

[00:37:37] It's time for Holy Discontent.

[00:37:40] Yeah, so it is what the man said.

[00:37:42] It's just a little time to vent.

[00:37:43] We'll let Paul go first.

[00:37:45] Then, Jim, if you have something, we'll let you go second and then I'll bring up the rear.

[00:37:49] Just a couple of minutes of something that you wish was fixed or different.

[00:37:54] Paul, fire away.

[00:37:56] Okay, so I'm down in Dallas right now visiting family for Thanksgiving and I turned on football

[00:38:01] yesterday and YouTube TV informs me that the NFL Sunday ticket is now $64.

[00:38:07] And it was $209 at the beginning of the season.

[00:38:11] So I thought, oh, maybe that's a deal I should make.

[00:38:14] It's what week 12 in the season, whatever it is.

[00:38:17] But then I realized that they did not include the NFL red zone in their deal, which is what someone who plays fantasy football with his buddies really needs.

[00:38:29] Right?

[00:38:30] So I just want to read to you guys what is included with the NFL red zone, which you have to pay an extra $12 a month on top of buying the NFL Sunday ticket.

[00:38:38] Here's what you get Fox soccer plus fan duel TV being sports, which I don't even know what that is the tennis channel, the fight network billiards TV impact wrestling Mavs TV, which is probably because I'm in Dallas.

[00:38:49] So they're trying to sell the Mavs players TV.

[00:38:53] Don't want to know what that is.

[00:38:54] And then poker go plus.

[00:38:56] So those are all the things I can get if I pay on top of my normal YouTube TV subscription.

[00:39:04] So I just took a pass on all of it.

[00:39:07] I'm a little frustrated because $64 a month feels like the right price for the Sunday ticket from the beginning of the season.

[00:39:14] And they ought to include the NFL red zone.

[00:39:16] If they were thinking about the fans, that's what they would do.

[00:39:18] Okay, I'm done.

[00:39:19] It's, it's almost like the, it's almost like the NFL has some revenue driven motivation here.

[00:39:27] I mean, maybe that's just me.

[00:39:28] I don't know.

[00:39:29] Jim, anything, anything bothering you?

[00:39:33] Well, they got to get to 10 billion somehow, Paul.

[00:39:36] Right.

[00:39:36] So that's the first thing.

[00:39:39] Yeah, this is funny because I read that in the notes that this might be coming my way.

[00:39:44] So this weekend, I was just thinking, did they change the out of bounds rule?

[00:39:48] I was watching several of the games, which were great this weekend.

[00:39:51] One went into overtime.

[00:39:53] Did you see how many 27, 30 games there were?

[00:39:55] Yes.

[00:39:56] 27 to 30.

[00:39:56] That was the score.

[00:39:57] But what I couldn't figure out is even if the offensive player was going out of bounds

[00:40:02] and moving forward, the clock kept running.

[00:40:05] Yeah.

[00:40:05] And I thought, have they changed the rule to this or what happened?

[00:40:09] So I was a little frustrated that it seems like I don't know the rules anymore.

[00:40:13] How frustrated do you think they are in Alabama regarding the proper formation rules in a moment that was a pretty key, pretty key time in that game?

[00:40:24] Just absolutely nuts.

[00:40:26] You will join Jim, our general officiating malaise that we talk about frequently here on the podcast.

[00:40:32] Quite often.

[00:40:32] I have a two part holy discontent.

[00:40:34] My first part is it's Ohio State week.

[00:40:36] So that's just part of the, that's just what it is as a Michigan Wolverine.

[00:40:40] And I just hope that at some point in the off season, whenever that comes that Ryan Day finally gets to locate Lou Holtz.

[00:40:48] But my really, my real holy discontent is that Paul Miller is blaming me for the Bears losing to the Vikings in overtime because I texted.

[00:41:00] And Jim, it leads me to a question.

[00:41:03] You have your close circle of friends and one would think that as a big time football fan,

[00:41:08] perhaps you guys engage in some text threads during games.

[00:41:12] What's the general rule for mentioning kind of like the, you know, telling a pitcher, talking about a pitcher having a no hitter.

[00:41:18] What's the general rule about texting about how it looks like a game is about to turn out?

[00:41:24] Because, because Paul almost blocked me yesterday.

[00:41:26] As I said, looks like the Bears are going to pull one out.

[00:41:33] Well, you never do that.

[00:41:34] Don't you know that?

[00:41:36] Bill, I can't believe you sent a note to Paul saying it looks like the Bears are going to win here.

[00:41:41] Well, I think it said, that's like the death knell.

[00:41:43] It said go Bears and maybe this time or something because as a Lions fan, we need the Vikings to lose a few times.

[00:41:49] So I was rooting for Paul's team and look what happened.

[00:41:54] See, it's kind of like this prayer that we got from an eight year old here at Focus on the Family over at the Welcome Center.

[00:41:59] This eight year old wrote, please pray for my brother who wets the bed and pray for me because I share a bed with my brother.

[00:42:08] That's that kind of prayer, Bill.

[00:42:10] So you weren't really rooting for Paul.

[00:42:12] You were rooting for your own team for Minnesota to go down.

[00:42:16] The Lord sorts you out.

[00:42:18] There are layers.

[00:42:20] There are layers to these prayers for sure.

[00:42:22] What motivation do you have?

[00:42:25] Well, it's selfish probably.

[00:42:27] It all comes back here for sure.

[00:42:30] All right.

[00:42:30] That's holy discontent.

[00:42:31] Now it's time for that guy.

[00:42:33] Right now, this minute today, this week.

[00:42:41] And we call out the guys who were kind of doing it right, having some fun.

[00:42:45] And we just want to give them a little extra shine.

[00:42:48] So Paul, take it away.

[00:42:49] Okay, I'm reading out again.

[00:42:50] So my that guy this week is Mike McDaniel, the coach of the Miami Dolphins.

[00:42:56] I caught this audio or this thing on Twitter from they played the Raiders.

[00:43:01] I think it was last week.

[00:43:03] And the Raiders have Tommy Eikenberg on their team.

[00:43:05] And McDaniel has Liam Eikenberg.

[00:43:09] So there's brothers going against each other.

[00:43:11] And I found this little audio clip of Mike McDaniel in the pregame before they started playing.

[00:43:16] Hey, just so you know, mom loves Liam more.

[00:43:21] Mom loves Liam more.

[00:43:24] Hey, I just told your brother that your mom loves you more.

[00:43:27] Guys, I like that.

[00:43:28] I think I'm in his head.

[00:43:30] I think I'm in his head.

[00:43:32] I got news for you, Mike.

[00:43:33] You're not in his head.

[00:43:34] But I love when guys can have fun in those tense moments like that.

[00:43:38] So well done, Mike McDaniel.

[00:43:40] That's my bad guy.

[00:43:41] Very cool.

[00:43:41] Jim, did you ever line up against your brother?

[00:43:47] No, he was 10 years older than me.

[00:43:48] Oh, 10 years older.

[00:43:49] So thankfully, he would have crushed me, I think.

[00:43:52] Yeah.

[00:43:52] He was a big dude, man.

[00:43:53] In high school, he was 6'5".

[00:43:55] Oh, man.

[00:43:56] I know Jim's got it.

[00:43:57] It would have been fun.

[00:43:57] It would have been fun.

[00:43:58] I think I would have gotten the head game though.

[00:44:00] I would have been all over that.

[00:44:01] Yeah.

[00:44:02] Jim's got kind of a heart out here coming up.

[00:44:04] So we want to make sure we honor your time.

[00:44:05] Let me just quickly share my that guy.

[00:44:08] Jim Harbaugh is a source of a lot of controversy and I happen to appreciate him as does, well,

[00:44:16] the father of a player who had an historically bad day.

[00:44:20] And this story was shared this week or last week on a podcast talking about Jim Harbaugh.

[00:44:27] Kenny Williams is one of those people, the White Sox, yeah.

[00:44:30] And we're sitting there and I think we were next to each other and I knew who he was

[00:44:32] and showed up a conversation there.

[00:44:34] And at the end, he says, hey, is Jim Harbaugh here?

[00:44:37] Because, you know, he knew what I was doing there and I said, yeah.

[00:44:39] And he goes, do you know where I could find him?

[00:44:41] And I said, no, but I'll find Bob Lang or somebody and we can connect.

[00:44:44] And I said, why do you ask?

[00:44:45] And he said, oh, I didn't mention this, but it's always something I wanted to do, which

[00:44:49] is that my son was on the 49ers and he was the one that muffed the punts in the NFC Championship game.

[00:44:56] Oh, wow.

[00:44:57] Wow.

[00:44:57] And he said that, wow, he wanted to thank Jim Harbaugh.

[00:45:01] I almost get emotional thinking about this now that I'm a parent.

[00:45:04] He said he wanted to thank Jim Harbaugh because when nobody loved his son, Jim Harbaugh did.

[00:45:10] And the love that Jim Harbaugh showed his son and the compassion when everybody was mad at him,

[00:45:16] he wanted to, as a man, father to father, thank him.

[00:45:20] And I'm not sure I've ever heard a better story about how to coach a team after a loss.

[00:45:27] And there's a reason the next year they were able to get to the Super Bowl.

[00:45:32] There's a reason, you know, like you just hear those stories and you go, okay, this, this makes sense.

[00:45:36] So I kind of like that story.

[00:45:38] It takes you away from sports and takes you into fatherhood and having a bigger picture approach.

[00:45:42] It's really good stuff.

[00:45:44] Um, Jim, I believe you're going to take us home with our closing devotional, our three minute message.

[00:45:50] So let me, uh, let me set it up for you and then we'll turn it over to you.

[00:45:54] Okay.

[00:45:55] Homer, I'd like you to remember Matthew 7, 26, the foolish man who built his house on sand.

[00:46:02] And you remember Matthew 21, 17.

[00:46:09] And he left them and went out of the city into Bethany and he lodged there.

[00:46:14] Yeah.

[00:46:15] Think about it.

[00:46:17] Can't think of a better introduction for the president to focus on the family than Homer Simpson quoting scripture.

[00:46:22] Jim, it's all yours.

[00:46:25] Well, we'll see if we can get, uh, you know, a couple minutes in here, but I, you know, I love that story of Jim Harbaugh.

[00:46:30] Cause I think that so rightfully depicts, uh, the relationship with a father and a son, right?

[00:46:36] The prodigal son story is awesome.

[00:46:38] And if you think about that, what that father did, his son who basically asked for his inheritance, took it and squandered, squandered that on women and drink and ended up poor and without any money feeding pigs in a pigsty for some faraway farmer.

[00:46:55] And he came to his senses, the scripture says, and thought I could go home and work for my dad as a laborer and be better off that I am here.

[00:47:05] I could at least have something to eat.

[00:47:07] So he had his plan and rehearsed how he was going to apologize to his father, but he was aiming just for a job basically.

[00:47:14] Cause he knew he had embarrassed his dad and he had, his dad was looking for him on the horizon.

[00:47:20] When he saw him, he did something that, you know, was not appropriate in that culture.

[00:47:24] He's hiked up his gowns and started running for his son.

[00:47:28] And he didn't care what people thought about him in that regard, that his son was coming home.

[00:47:34] I'm sure he stank.

[00:47:35] I'm sure he was repugnant in most ways, his physical appearance, his smell.

[00:47:41] And yet his dad came up, hugged him, kissed him and set a feast for him.

[00:47:47] And I think it's such a beautiful representation of what the father has for each one of us.

[00:47:53] You know, a pastor recently told me, we don't know the lavish love of God.

[00:47:59] How about that idea that he loves us lavishly, not just loves us, but loves us in such an extreme way.

[00:48:08] And, you know, so many people that I've talked to that have had an encounter, you know,

[00:48:12] we talked about John Burke off camera about that whole idea of near death experience.

[00:48:18] Uh, John's interviewed, I think about 2000 people from around the world.

[00:48:21] And he said, one of the common attributes of somebody that has a near death experience is this immense love that they feel in that moment coming from a throne that they don't understand the moment they're in.

[00:48:33] But isn't that something that that's the one thing that they come back and say, this is what I felt was this overwhelming sense of love.

[00:48:40] And I think the point of this little devotional is to say that God loves you that much.

[00:48:45] He loved you so much in that way, that lavish love that he sent his son to die for you.

[00:48:52] Forget, you know, Paul, Bill and I, he gave his son for you and you alone.

[00:48:59] And, uh, that's the amazing lavish love of the father running after the wayward son, which is each one of us.

[00:49:07] And I just am reminded of, I'm reminded of that all the time, that that's the love I feel from the father.

[00:49:13] And I hope you feel it as well.

[00:49:15] Yeah. That's so good.

[00:49:16] Jim, we cannot thank you enough for spending some time with us.

[00:49:19] I know that your schedule is packed and, uh, thanks to your team.

[00:49:23] Thanks to Kurt and everybody who helped kind of bring us all together.

[00:49:26] It would be an honor, whether it's at Augusta or not, to someday be able to tee it up with you and just spend some time talking some more.

[00:49:34] So thank you.

[00:49:34] And, uh, who knows, maybe we'll have that connection at some point down the road.

[00:49:38] Lord bless you.

[00:49:39] And we will be praying for focus in the team and for you in the leadership role too.

[00:49:44] Thank you so very much.

[00:49:46] Appreciate it, Paul.

[00:49:47] Thank you, Bill.

[00:49:47] You got it.

[00:49:48] Hope you'll join us next time on Church Pew Sports.

[00:49:51] Thanks for listening.

[00:49:51] Hit that subscribe button and please share the link with other sports fans in your world.

[00:49:56] We'll talk to you next time on Church Pew Sports.