Pt 2: Dr Pamela Pyle + Cultivating a 'Good Death'

[00:00:00] Welcome to the Ask About My Faith Podcast where our hope is to inspire everyday faith conversations.

[00:00:09] I'm Jess and I'm Abby. Today we're back with Dr. Pamela Pyle. If you didn't hear part 1,

[00:00:15] you have to start there. Her faith story is so beautiful. Pamela is a wife, mother to five,

[00:00:22] grandmother to eight. She's an adventure, an author, a poet and considers herself a reckless

[00:00:28] dreamer. Pamela is an internal medicine physician and last week we heard some about her time in

[00:00:35] Rwanda growing and founding the Dream Medical Center, which if you don't remember is a state of

[00:00:42] the art hospital where she currently serves as the chair of the board. In 2019 Pamela began writing

[00:00:49] on the topic of a good death. She was inspired when a patient who was dying brought peace to the

[00:00:55] room saying it's okay, it'll be a good death. Pamela shares that a good death is not an event but

[00:01:02] rather a lifestyle that should be cultivated sooner rather than later. Her book,

[00:01:08] anticipating heaven will launch in January 2025 and we're going to hear a fun story of how a life

[00:01:16] was changed as Pamela simply shared her vision and motivation for the book in a marketing meeting.

[00:01:23] First let's jump in and pick right back up with another inspiring story from Rwanda.

[00:01:33] Okay Pamela, in the last episode we talked about some of the incredible work that you're doing

[00:01:39] in Rwanda and so we would love for you to share the story that you have for us about your

[00:01:45] sponsored students. So African New Life is about child sponsorship and as I mentioned we have

[00:01:55] about 12,000 kids that are sponsored by my very first trip and met a young boy who actually was 15

[00:02:06] but only in third grade and he had been a refugee and living in a refugee camp and

[00:02:15] at that point I just wanted to sponsor a child, in fact I sponsored two children from his community

[00:02:24] and he couldn't speak any English, he didn't know the Lord but through the years

[00:02:33] we just each time I would visit I would visit him and his family, love, love, love his family

[00:02:42] and I was always moved that his father would pray for me when I would come into the house or when

[00:02:50] Scott would come into the house and when I'm saying house it's not, it's a mud home.

[00:02:59] Sure but through the years you know a mobily just began to blossom and he accepted the Lord

[00:03:12] and I wasn't there when it happened but his child development officer emailed me and said

[00:03:20] you know I just want you to know a mobily and so the next time that I got to see him

[00:03:26] it was so exciting for him to share his story of coming to the Lord but he also in that process

[00:03:36] learned his love for worship and so he ultimately became a worship leader in his high school

[00:03:44] and led others to Christ and then at the time he was graduating high school, he was speaking English

[00:03:56] and qualified to go to college and so we put him through college and he did exceedingly well

[00:04:08] he sings the church that I did the medical clinic the very first time

[00:04:14] he was doing worship all through college with the worship team there

[00:04:19] and then as he graduated college he got a job with African New Life

[00:04:26] and he's now a child development officer in a community that is very close to where he grew up

[00:04:32] so he just sees family a lot and through having a job he now is able to care for his elderly parents

[00:04:41] so it's wonderful in fact I just and another fun fact is so now we emailed back before the lot

[00:04:52] and one of my other sponsored students who's a kindergartener now

[00:04:58] he's her child development officer so he gives me the background of what's happening to her name's

[00:05:06] Jolly and what's happening with Jolly and she's doing very well at school

[00:05:12] so Pamela did I hear you right that when you started sponsoring him he was 15 and he was at a

[00:05:19] third grade level yes and then in just a matter of a few years so it's been since 2009 he's now

[00:05:29] working so he caught up and wow the path and that's it yes and that's a story for a lot of our

[00:05:39] students and our amazing sponsors is they developed a relationship with them and they become part

[00:05:48] of the family and many sponsors come with us and get to visit their students in Rwanda which is

[00:05:57] say sponsoring a student changes their lives but visiting the student of changes yours

[00:06:05] so that's one of the beauties of what we did well and it kind of ties back into what we were

[00:06:12] talking about last week too where you're meeting physical needs in such a tangible way but it's when

[00:06:18] you have shelter and food and you feel safe then you can like learn to grow and your mind is open

[00:06:25] to more education and things like that so yeah it's so beautiful we'll include some links in our

[00:06:31] show notes for anybody that that wants a sponsor child or look more into Africa new life so thank you

[00:06:37] so much for sharing that story. You're welcome and I just want to say if you happen to sponsor from this

[00:06:45] podcast the next time I go I will visit your child and make sure that you get that first personal

[00:06:53] experience so cool. Wow amazing gift. Okay I think we're going to transition from Rwanda back to

[00:07:02] the US and some more stories on this side of the planet I know you have a story to share it you

[00:07:11] had said it's one of your favorites of a gentleman named Robert can you share that story with

[00:07:16] our listeners? Sure so just to go a little back from the last episode is

[00:07:28] Jesus taught me that hearing the gospel was not like just a one-size-fits-all and I and so he really

[00:07:40] gave me this expression that you know listen to the Holy Spirit within you and sometimes the Holy

[00:07:48] Spirit will give you the exact words and say go and then sometimes the Holy Spirit will say no

[00:07:58] and you need to listen and then sometimes you don't have to say a thing I just want you to stand

[00:08:05] there and I'm going to do it all and by starting to learn to listen to the Holy Spirit it changed

[00:08:15] everything with how I share the gospel and this Robert was a particularly wonderful example because

[00:08:27] he was an elderly man dying of cancer and I had been with him two or three days working in the hospital

[00:08:37] and he just was so fearful and angry and didn't have a lot of words but on the third day that

[00:08:55] I just was very consistent about you know and I would say can I pray for you because that was one

[00:09:02] of those where the the Spirit wasn't saying these are the words and so when that's when it's a

[00:09:09] mode hardly anyone says no prayer and so I would pray for him each time I left well on the third day

[00:09:18] he had more questions you know about Jesus and so I like that down I'm like I'm not your doctor

[00:09:30] I'm putting my doctor jacket off I'm just there you go someone passionately in love with Jesus

[00:09:36] and yeah let me tell you about my story and so I share my story and I share who Jesus was

[00:09:45] and why he came and that he loved Robert even though he had not Robert had rejected him his entire life

[00:09:57] and so during that visit Robert asked to pray with me about accepting Jesus

[00:10:05] and we prayed together and at the end he was crying and I was putting my jacket back on

[00:10:13] and he said would you stay in here so I can call my daughter because

[00:10:20] he's been praying for me for many years about Jesus and I just want her to know that I accepted him

[00:10:27] and I'd love for you to be here and so we both got on the phone we were passing the phone back and

[00:10:33] for it was it was squeal through the phone and enjoy and when I I lost the room I I linked it

[00:10:45] to the wall I did one of those moments that like are forever in your brain yeah and I said

[00:10:56] Lord

[00:11:01] every suffering every difficulty

[00:11:04] every gift if I never have another moment like this one I am so grateful for this one and what you did

[00:11:18] for Robert and he ended up dying the next day but it was not sadness and it was

[00:11:34] this sense of like God loves us so much love Robert so much that he brought the right person at

[00:11:43] the right time and you know that's what he's intimately weaving our lives together all the time

[00:11:52] and when we just like start to hear you know Jesus said so many times ears to hear

[00:12:02] I think it was really talking to us too is like I'm speaking to you you know are you listening

[00:12:10] and when we start listening with spiritual ears he puts people in our pathway all the time

[00:12:18] and it's a joy man Pamela you what a beautiful story what a beautiful story I um you know I just as

[00:12:27] I'm sitting here we're sitting here looking at you and hearing your stories I know that you are an

[00:12:32] amazing amazingly accomplished and recognized doctor and yet I love that this is one of the stories

[00:12:42] that probably tops your list of biggest accomplishments when it comes to you know being a doctor

[00:12:50] and and all the people's lives you've changed and affected I love that this is at the top of it

[00:12:55] hmm well it is because as a believer when we get to be there when Christ says someone

[00:13:03] it changes you and it it's almost an addiction because you know there's nothing like it you know

[00:13:12] yeah because I know whatever I do medically it's it's transitory

[00:13:18] hmm hmm and I mean he thinking about Robert you said um three days three days prior to that

[00:13:26] you know he he was sound like he was kind of a grumpy right he's just an understandable look

[00:13:34] at where he's at I can't imagine and but he went from being very closed off and just

[00:13:40] probably ready for the end to accepting the Lord three days later and man the next day

[00:13:48] God calls him home oh my gosh I can't wait to see him oh so cool well uh so Pamela you are in the

[00:13:58] process of writing a book we would love for you to share about your book um maybe a little bit of

[00:14:04] your kind of inspiration for writing it and then you also have a pretty cool story about how

[00:14:13] God's used the process I don't want to give away too much of the story that you have that kind

[00:14:19] of comes comes out of that but let's hear about your book so um I've always been a journaler it's

[00:14:29] kind of helped me you know since I became a believer it's helped me process things I read my prayers

[00:14:36] you know and it's been just it's a lot of fun to go back and see how God answers them

[00:14:42] um but about five years ago I was with a patient and it been in and out of the hospital and

[00:14:52] was doing poorly and she asked to see me and so I went in and I was sitting on the edge of her bed

[00:15:01] and holding her hand and she had a lung condition so she was having difficulty breathing and

[00:15:08] but she said I am ready to let go and but I have some questions for you and so her questions were

[00:15:22] very direct of you know what I can what she could expect what she'll feel what her family will

[00:15:31] experience and as she's asking things very direct questions I just start weeping because I

[00:15:43] realized that in that moment I knew how much I was going to miss her I was just the doctor she saw

[00:15:50] periodically when she came to the hospital and I looked around a room and her family and the

[00:15:58] pictures and grandchildren's drawings were there and I was thinking how much they're going to miss her

[00:16:06] but this little lady with strength that kind of defies imagination grabs my hands

[00:16:15] and says it's okay it'll be a good day and I knew what she meant by that because of our

[00:16:24] conversations about heaven and her knowing her destination she was confident in that

[00:16:33] but when I left the room I just again another lean against the ball moment where the phrase of good death

[00:16:44] really burrowed down into my soul and and

[00:16:48] hmm God and Jesus just have pressing in on me about okay a good death I know the heavenly destination is

[00:16:59] good but I'd seen so much poor dying through the years you know patients not informed prepared

[00:17:10] equipped families you know struggling not processing information so I just began writing and

[00:17:21] not really at the time thinking now this is going to be a book but writing all the the things that

[00:17:29] help patients get through suffering or serious diagnosis or terminal diagnosis

[00:17:38] sure like here's the questions to ask when you see your doctor and you get that diagnosis or

[00:17:47] here's what will happen when you go to the hospital as patients don't have the practical

[00:17:53] but let me give you the hope of anticipating heaven even in the midst of your suffering so it

[00:18:03] if they get it began a long journey of leading to a book that will be coming out in January 25

[00:18:14] with Harper Collins Christian is called anticipating heaven and so I wanted

[00:18:23] the faith to be the primary focus but still give people what they need in their dying process

[00:18:32] and help them with their fears as regardless if you're a believer or not you still have fears when

[00:18:39] you hear a bad diagnosis yeah and so then you had a marketing meeting right yes so

[00:18:53] again it's one of those things where you start a conversation and have Jesus in it

[00:19:00] you start listening and watching for cues to the individual that is a part of a conversation

[00:19:10] and and again sometimes you know you hear the spirit say go and sometimes wait

[00:19:17] in the meeting I was just really expressing the purpose behind the book and also

[00:19:27] who Jesus was to me and one of the people in the room was clearly a believer and chatting

[00:19:40] back and forth in the other older gentleman um he didn't say much but he followed me out to my car

[00:19:49] and he asked me more questions about Jesus and I just share more and then I prayed for him

[00:20:00] and the next day I got an email from him and he said I went home and I prayed with my wife to

[00:20:10] and I accepted Jesus and so it's just it's so fun and Jesus is so fancy you know he just

[00:20:21] he just does amazing things you know um and we get to be a part of it um Pamela that's so cool

[00:20:31] that um man followed you out to your car reminds me I mean this is probably a little bit of a

[00:20:36] stretch but where my mind went it reminds me of the woman with the issue of blood and all she

[00:20:42] wants is just to touch Jesus's cloak and in that moment it seemed he he just knew he just knew

[00:20:49] he had to yeah just needed just a little bit more and he just knew that if he just followed you out

[00:20:56] and just could ask another question or two yeah that's just that's what he needed and that's just

[00:21:02] thank you yeah it probably took him a lot of courage to and humility to like ask the questions

[00:21:10] and um and I want to commend you too for like not being inconvenienced because you know

[00:21:17] you know I have my next you can't be in I mean it's really impossible to be inconvenience when

[00:21:25] when someone's asking you fake question is it yeah it's like okay everything stops this is the most

[00:21:32] important thing in my life at this moment Pamela can I ask you um this maybe something that

[00:21:40] goes in with the podcast or maybe something we cut out or move aside but I'm curious to hear

[00:21:46] how you go into your day um prepared how do you invite the Lord to to to guide your day and to be

[00:21:54] at the center of everything you do because it's so evident that he is at the center of all of your

[00:22:00] interactions how how do you do that what does that look like for you so um I get up at 5 a.m

[00:22:10] because oh boy and I wasn't a 5 a.m. kind of writer but I realized that I needed to get up

[00:22:18] that early to have that time and so I get my cup of coffee and I sit down with my Bible

[00:22:27] um independent on you know the season I I have a different approach but

[00:22:36] currently I'm reading through the Bible um you know reading through it in a year um which I've

[00:22:45] done two times before and I have the same Bible that Scott gave me when I first got saved

[00:22:54] and I always you know if I if God like gives me a verse that stands out or I hear something

[00:23:03] you know in church and I've written in the margins I always write the day um so I had from 1996

[00:23:14] to this morning little notes and I'll put the month in the year if it's something that I've written

[00:23:21] you know because I wanted to be able to see well what year was God speaking this person

[00:23:29] and so reading through the Bible from beginning to end has a certain beauty to it that yeah

[00:23:37] I I just felt like this year was the year that I wanted to do it again and

[00:23:43] I I I as I mentioned by journals so I write down the verses that stand out to me and then

[00:23:54] write my prayer

[00:23:57] that's great that's great yeah it's a good way to set up your day

[00:24:01] it's the only way to get through any kind of day in my mind otherwise you know I'm like it's a crazy

[00:24:08] yeah yeah sure oh man I can't wait to hear um or to read your book anticipating heaven

[00:24:15] I'm gonna make a note of that you also had another recommendation for our listeners about a book

[00:24:21] walk across the room was that a pretty impactful book for you yes so that was written by Bill Hybles

[00:24:29] and I read it probably in the early 2000s um and it really is that

[00:24:38] if you look around a crowded room you know no matter what circumstance you almost always

[00:24:45] will find someone who's clearly a little uncomfortable or standing alone and it's a perfect

[00:24:54] opportunity to walk across the room and get to know them and sometimes that's well actually usually

[00:25:04] it's a lot of listening um and you'd be surprised you know when you listen intently

[00:25:13] how many touch points we have in common with someone else and um gently steering them to

[00:25:23] anything they're going through because the way I view suffering is we either exiting the season

[00:25:31] or in a season or about to enter a season of suffering and sometimes it's a difficult season

[00:25:37] really hard suffering and sometimes it's getting through something minor but it's still you know

[00:25:46] ways on someone's mind and so finding where someone's suffering a little bit and then saying

[00:25:55] urgently you know can I pray with you about that um it gives you an opportunity to open

[00:26:04] base conversations that's so good and that um is really cool how it ties back to your story of

[00:26:12] meeting so many people yeah in their seasons of suffering and a good reminder for our listeners to

[00:26:19] um to make that first move take that first step to connect with the person who who might need

[00:26:27] that conversation well Pamela thank you so much gosh we probably have more more stories that we could

[00:26:34] have you on join us again for a conversation down the road but

[00:26:39] man thank you to share this with our listeners thank you so much for having me it was the joy

[00:26:45] thank you for listening to the Ask But My Faith podcast we'd love your support in continuing to

[00:26:53] bring you encouraging and inspiring stories please subscribe rate interview wherever you're listening

[00:26:59] and you can learn more about us and donate at askbutmyfave.com God bless you this week as you go out and share your faith